Bush dodges same-sex marriage issue at UK committee
(CNS): Eric Bush, the Cayman Islands representative in London, told the Foreign Affairs Select Committee in the British House of Commons on Tuesday that he could not answer questions about the territory’s position on same-sex marriage because of a case currently going through the local courts. Bush appeared before the committee as part of a review of the relationship between Britain and its overseas territories and was asked questions on a number of subjects. But when former overseas territories minister Chris Bryant, the Labour member for Rhondda, asked Bush about the issue of gay marriage, Bush declined to comment because he is a civil servant.
Bryant quizzed Bush, who had spoken a great deal about the Cayman Islands being British, about Cayman’s failure to recognise the legal marriages of same-sex couples, and asked him why the territory still wants to be British so much when it does not subscribe to British values like marriage equality.
“The issue of same-sex marriage is subject to legal challenge in the Cayman Islands, currently, so it would be inappropriate for me to expand on that,” Bush told Bryant, and when pressed, he refused to submit anything further.
Former overseas territories minister Chris Bryant
Bryant asked Bush his own view on same-sex marriage, but the Cayman representative responded, “I am a civil servant and it would be inappropriate for me to give an opinion on behalf of the Cayman Islands on any government policy.”
Bush was accompanied by Dr Peter Clegg, an associate professor in Politics and International Relations at the University of the West of England, who explained that there had been historic challenges with the Caribbean British territories over these issues. Clegg said on the marriage issue, the Caribbean, including the British territories, was divergent from the British government policy and approach in general because certain groups, including church groups, are pushing very strongly against it. However, he said that the judicial route may be a way that things start to change.
But Bryant said it seemed that Cayman wanted to have its cake and eat it, noting, “You want to be part of the British umbrella but not part of British life.”
Bryant, who is in a same-sex marriage, was the overseas territories minister in 2010, when he became the first homosexual MP to enter into a civil partnership in a ceremony held in the Houses of Parliament. During his time as the minister responsible for the territories he placed considerable pressure on then leader McKeeva Bush to introduce new revenue streams before he would agree to support further borrowing to cover the 2010 budget.
Category: Politics
Well done bush. If I had to answer i would have told him whats he needs to hear.
Double standard islands
Couln not answer questions “on the grounds that ……” LOL DWL
all marriage should be banned….do a lot of people a favor…..
This is so true. Why bother?
Such a farce isn’t it.
Chris (not an agent from heaven) want to IMPOSE his values on Caymanians despite our rights and autonomy! He should be reminded that many in the UK oppose his views!
Eric responded positively.
This is really not that difficult. No one’s suggesting imposing any values on anyone.
If you don’t like gay marriages don’t get one (and feel free to hold that opinion). But, in the same way you’d be upset about someone telling you what your values should be about gay marriage, so are other people when you IMPOSE your values on them.
So long as you accept no one should be telling other people how to live their lives when it doesn’t affect anyone else this is very easy. If you can’t accept that premise then you’re the one doing the imposing.
You have a right to discriminate? Since when?
If that is a right you claim perhaps you could source it for the rest of us
On what legal basis does this right originate?
Agreed Caymanian T , Eric responded positively and appropriately . But it just show that Chris only have LGBT rights in his head by the one and only question he asked .
LGBT rights or gay rights are not what we call HUMAN RIGHTS or NATURAL RIGHTS because they are not based on human existence. Rather, they are a special category of rights for a minority or group that is imposed on everyone. Human Rights would be the right of speech, religion, protection from hate crimes, peaceful assembly, to voice your own conscience, the right of a child to have a mom and a dad, et cetera … these are Human Rights.
But that you must accept and recognize my marriage, or else, you will be fined or charged for “discrimination,” I ask what natural basis are you persecuting me? There is no gay gene, and the world is not born gay! Then why are you using the government, you socialist, to force me to comply with your entitles???
Learn the difference. When they talk about right impose on everyone – its really asking for a totalitarian system.
Unison
Unison you’re implying that you’re the victim here. YOU impose on others that they must conform to your preferences. No one is telling you to change your sexual orientation or be a part of any of it.
If civil unions were legal for gay people, absolutely NOTHING would change in your world. If they were allowed those EQUAL rights as fellow humans, we would allow a Caymanian to happily return home!
But no you must use a 2000 year old text to fulfill your personal agenda and discriminate against another sexuality because of your ‘HOLIER’ than thou stance.
Peace, love and equality is all I wish for my fellow Caymanians. Love all unna.
Its always dangerous when someone in such a position as Bryant because of their own particular persuasion wants to impose their own obviously personal views on others such as the Cayman Islands who believe differently. Doesn’t this amount to bullying.
Not much else he could say was there? Anything he went on record with could have been used against CIG.
Just remember that Chris Bryant is a posturing self-styled LGBT advocate who is probably doing a lot more harm than good to their cause in the UK.
A posturing self styled advocate who has more votes behind his membership of parliament than the entire Cayman voting population. And from a notoriously old fashioned constituency as welll. Oh, and he is a former vicar as well, so no doubt familiar with the religious arguments. But no problem, just go ahead and discount his views because they don’t accord with yours
Jotnot So? Doesn’t mean he is right.
So being a part of ‘British life’ means adopting the views and lifestyles of an ignorant, vehemently biased tyrant? That make a lot of sense…
Let’s all hold hands and jump off the Bluff while we’re at it.
UK only just allowed gay marriage, it’s not a historically relevant tradition.
Now, should we try to ban tea drinking they would really have a reason to toss us out or accuse of not being British.
So our defense is we like living in the past?
Cause that is essentially what you are saying here bud
It’s not even legalized in the UK, Northern Ireland still hasn’t legalized it, but of course that’s not relevant because reasons
Pathetic from Bush and shows the mindset of CIG through and through. The pending case is no reason not to answer the question unless one is an avoiding coward unwilling to admit the Government’s position is to defend bigotry.
“Intolerance” is a better word.
What is bigotry? Do you know that?
It was not fair or reasonable to expect Eric to answer such a political question which would have set him at odds with
the jurisdiction’s political masters if he had given a yes or no answer.
To say that Eric’s reasoning for not providing a yes or no answer implied that the people of Cayman want their cake and eat it too was self serving and bullying as well as inconsiderate of all of the circumstances.
Eric said that the Cayman Court is in the process of deciding the issue and he was right to say it was inappropriate for him to answer further.
It was wrong of Mr. Bryant to ask him to express his personal view. He was not there in his personal capacity.
I say well done Eric. That was a hot seat you were in.
I fully support same sex marriage myself and hope that we do soon provide for it as a basic human right in these islands.
While I agree with your comments, it’s probably a good thing that someone as high up the pecking order of CIG as Eric to feel some pressure or unfairness, as I imagine our LGBT brothers and sisters must feel the same everyday. Hopefully it may cause a degree of understanding and empathy too often left out.
Isn’t CIG defending the same sex marriage case? Their position seems pretty clear to me.
I think that the Islands Financial services are far more important to have represented than same sex marriage , and Mr Bush did achieve that with grace , even though he was a little nervous at times . If you listened to the hearing you would’ve have got that the issue was not about same sex marriage , but he did say that it is a complicated subject and he Mr. Bush couldn’t answer for the people on that question .
No, incredibly, CIG are on the opposite camp – fighting the legal civil obligation to recognize, protect, and conduct loving same sex civil unions – which CIG and various Church groups conflate with holy consecrated marriages performed, in the presence of God, in Churches by ordained ministers.
Apologies I meant that CIG is defending their current position that same sex marriage is not permitted.
I don’t blame them not to fight against same sex marriage law. Why place marriage as it is on the same plane with a same gender union? And then say everyone must acknowledge it!
We don’t need to be like the UK and their stupid level of political correctness trying not to offend every religion, minority group and the lgbtxyz community. We have every right to stand behind our definition of marriage as between a man and a woman.
“lgbtxyz”? Cute. You think that one up all by yourself?
No, lots of mindless homophobes who think they are funny have been their before or minor offensive variations thereon.
??? English please.
3.27pm I think you understand what was meant. Don’t be mean.
But Mr. Bryant has a point. Either we are with the British or we are not. Many Caymanians take for granted the autonomy that the UK has granted us – that autonomy can be revoked at any time. Let’s not forget that our beloved “constitution” of 2009 is a “constitutional order” which, in British legalese, means that the UK can override it at any point.
This is more that just about same-sex marriage; this is about whether or not we subscribe to British values. Anyone who can’t understand this is missing the forest for the trees.
And yes, I come ya by pain, I na come ya by plane.
British territory does not mean we have to adopt British culture
Human rights is not a cultural thing. If you think that then I feel bad your culture is hate.
How on earth do you get hate from that comment? There are many examples of British colonies that are/were far removed from British culture. There is no relevance to hate.
You clearly didn’t watch the full video when Eric Bush stated that being British is the foundation of Caymanian culture. Therefore, I’m finding great difficulty in making sense of your comment, sir/madam.
This has nothing to do with British culture, but British law.
“British culture”….no. But British law….yes!
We need not allow same sex “marriage”….but we are legally obliged to offer some remedy to those impacted, and “civil unions” will provide that.
We are going to throw huge sums of the peoples money at fighting this (because it’s politically advantageous to the powers that be) knowing full well that we will lose. Even if Cayman’s Courts find in favour of CIG…the British can (and will…sooner or later) then make an Order in Council.
I always see postings for “civil unions”! I think its a no deal!
If these folks gay lifestyle are recognized in any way, and their marriage has to be taught in schools, and taken as an acceptable lifestyle in our country, I sorry Nauticalone, it will mean the moral decline of our society, and you will be at fault.
Because of you, they will be asking for more than a two party marriage. What about 3 parties, or 4, and pedophiles want too, and incest too, and the list goes on. Original marriage will lose its sanctity! And more sex crimes!
And what of the many “far right” hate crimes? Those occur everyday….where is your outcry over that?
You’re right. Away with that pesky human rights thing. What a bother to your otherwise tranquil self.
Human rights and the definition of marriage are not the same thing. Perhaps you should put a bit a thought into your otherwise tranquil self. Have you heard of civil union vs marriage? Both carry rights, but not both are defined the same.
Congrats Mr Bush you represented your country very well. Your diplomatic answers need to be taugh to several. Thats how you represent a country. Well done!!!
Yes Pa
Well done Eric…we are proud of you. Most of the CNS haters are jealous of you or too dumb to appreciate your reasoned reaponse.
Ha! Everything you just wrote is too funny to even comment back at. I love that you topped it off with “responsed response”. Oh boy, thanks for the early morning laughs.
It says reasoned response…
Actually it says “reasoned reaponse”.
I have dispatched the Grammar Police.
It says reasoned reaponse. My God, you are all ignorant.
Get a grip. its hard to type on your phone in traffic.
Also illegal.
Who said we wanted to be “british” so much? We just need your help thats all. That doesnt mean we have to wear rainbow t-shirts.
“Parents, I need your money to survive and your house to give me shelter in hard times, but I refuse to follow your rules!”
Grow up. You don’t have to like it, support it, approve of it, etc. Just let them do them and you do you. Don’t make it illegal simply because them loving each other isn’t in alignment with your preferences.
819 am: I don’t think we have to accept all values that the UK espouses. Even parents acknowledge that their children grow up to be adults with minds of their own.
And by the way, your metaphor is weak, as the UK has never fed or clothed us, in good times or in bad, even in more recent times when we were devastated by Hurricane Ivan.
In fact, we have extended much more generosity to the UK than they to us, witness the 1982 “Mother Needs your Help Fund.” For those no aware, the Cayman Islands rallied to the UK’s Falklands ward effort with a rather impressive people-initiated donation.
So if that is the case, behave like the now grown children and move out the house (i.e. go independent). Hmm…wait… we can’t do that because it would mean a serious disruption to economic stability and national security…
Sorry mom, looks like I need to move back into my room again…
…Talk about missing the forest for the trees.
2:50 pm: We have long been financially independent. We bear the name only.
It is the U.K. that keeps demanding parental rights.
Using your own weak analogy: a child grows up and assumes responsibility for his or her own existence, but the parent insists that the child must either accept all rules or values or relinquish the family name, with no regard for other more appropriate options.
Again, if that is the case. Let’s declare independence…and watch as our beloved house of cards crumbles due to that move. As for my “weak analogy”, I was only building off what the previous commenter posted.
Everyone keep calm and do not feed the troll
Yep, they have never fed us or clothed us, they need to return our million dollars we sent them in 1982. I am past 70 years and the only thing I can remember getting was one lead pencil with a tin foil top with an eraser in it. We also had people in the wind rush effort and was never properly paid. Also my father, among others volunteered to go to Trinidad with the Royal Navy during the Second World War. They must owe him something for that. I think Mr. Bush did a good job representing Cayman. Measured responses just like the Brits, he must have learnt that from them.
Would rather be independent and the clowns can stay in their own countries.
@12:32 Much rather their clowns than our.. OH sorry thought you meant the clowns leading the CIG.
You say that until you actually become independent. Hope you have a US passport then…
No no they arent our “parents” we just happened to be 24 miles long and would need help along the way my friend. You think it would be easy if we were independant? Further more the UK decided to say they “found” our beloved isle one day sailing when people were already here, now hundreds of years later we have to wear their rainbow t shirts. Dont worry we forgave them for that so just leave us with our values of and thoughts of what marriage is supposed to be. We are not marching in the nations capital carrying on about it, only now that we are being bullied into complying with other countries disgusting ways. Leave us alone mate.
…ah boy…where ignorance is bliss…
Eric is who said that
“Who said we wanted to be “british” so much?”
Uhhmmmm… sorry to break it to you buddy but:
The Caymanian people in 1962 when we got the same offer Jamaica did
The Caymanian people when we accepted the redefined role of the UK in any one of our 5 constitutions most recently in 2009
The Caymanian People when we put the Union Jack in the top corner of our flag
Shall I continue?
If you are going to try to be a smart ass
I would suggest actually being smart, read a XXXX history book at least
Because if you leave that part out you are just being an ass
Just for fun, would you not say that in 1962 the right choice was made, since the strength of the Caymanian Dollar is one of the major reasons all flock to these Islands? What other choice would you so smartly have taken on behalf of the Islands if you were in power to do so at that time? Further more, sexual orientation should not be what is on debate, as most people would not have a clue what goes on in each persons home. Why is it that every culture must bend and yield to the outside world or face the wrath of other powerful countries. Only children are forced to be where they are. All adults have a choice to be where they feel loved and can live a happy life, all the stress and frustration just doesn’t seem so happy and proud now does it.
So much vulgarity, shirt on vocabulary vorcwhat?
You are clearly part of the rhetoric Nick Clegg mentioned. And pardon the pun but we will be made to bend over and accept same sex marriage as UK has legislated. Just watch.
Smh … the rainbow was the sign given to Noah after the Flood! I have to wonder what in the hell the LGBT groups were thinking about mimicking these colors on their t-shirts and pride flag??? And to know that such sins like homosexuality were said to be the reasons why the antideluvian world was destroyed in the first place. To use such colors in public celebrating the gay lifestyle is a mockery to the Holy One, which means they need to repent. They are playing with fire!
Excuse me if Im preaching hate. Just sharing factual religious knowledge. But I might be accuse of bigotry because of this :))
Cringing, pathetic performance for an overpaid civil servant.
If you can’t even state a personal opinion on same-sex marriage, you’re too weak to represent.
You cannot be a civil servant and express a personal opinion in the circumstances Eric was in.
You na even supposed to “like” a politician on FB if you’re a civil servant yet these dense fools are calling him pathetic for not personally standing up against equal rights. Appalling.
No, that was actually a correct response. His personal view had no relevance there. The Gov’t’s lack of a prepared response, rather than ducking the question, is the real issue.
This. Not sure why he was even asked for his personal view
Eric wasn’t there to express his personal opinion.
Frankly, I think that it was inappropriate for Wroc to be there in the first place. The Premier was the more appropriate spokesperson.
I like this Bryant guy.
What a coward. No balls to be found.
7.12pm Referring to Mr Bryant of course
7:12 pm lol
Because it takes no courage at all to be truthful about your sexuality when people are calling you an abomination and telling you you’ll burn in hell for eternity?
A weak minded leader, just what the 21st century needs.
which one?
Then we have to hope that he and his Labour Party don’t regain power.