Caymanians urged to have more kids
(CNS): MLA Chris Saunders (BTW) has said that Caymanians need to “make more children” to prevent the country from getting into future trouble as a result of a declining birth rate. The opposition MLA made the plea to the country during a debate about amending the Labour Law to make maternity leave provisions for private sector workers equal to those offered in the civil service.
Presenting his private member’s motion asking government to consider aligning maternity leave between the civil service and the private sector, Saunders explained that the Legislative Assembly had a responsibility to make laws for good government that should be equal and inclusive.
But mothers employed in the private sector, while having the same objectives, responsibilities and challenges as those in the civil service, were not equal and were getting far less maternity leave. While public sector mothers are getting two months paid and one month unpaid leave, those in the private sector get only one month of their time off paid.
He said the inconsistency needed to be corrected for several reasons, not least that government needed to take a leadership role in promoting family life because Caymanians were not replacing themselves. He said Cayman had poor parental rights, which would need to be improved in the long run as the jurisdiction developed. But in the meantime, this alignment would be a step in the right direction.
Despite Cayman’s strong support for family life, the birth rate is falling, with couples now having less than two children on average.
“We need to accept as our population is getting older and we don’t have enough people coming behind us to replace ourselves, this is going to be a problem,” he said, noting that the fertility rate here is 1.87%, which includes non-Caymanians.
Caymanians were not growing their own “indigenous population”, which would cause structural problems down the line if this issue was not addressed, Saunders said, as he implied that increasing maternity leave could help.
“I know some members have gone out and made multiple children… I’ve made three so I’m above the natural replacement rate,” he said, adding that he and his wife had done their job and pointed to other members who had contributed to growing the population.
While he accepted that consideration had to be given to small businesses, he suggested an incremental increase to the maternity benefit to give businesses time to plan. Saunders spoke about the need for more long-term planning in Cayman and to use the census, expected to take place in October, to inform that planning.
Premier Alden McLaughlin said that government was prepared to accept the motion and consider the proposal.
The original motion was amended to increase the time period for government to address the issue to the end of 2021.
See the motion in the CNS Library
See the motion debate on CIGTV below:
- Fascinated
- Happy
- Sad
- Angry
- Bored
- Afraid
This country is failing miserably at educating the existing children here and providing actual solid opportunities for their future. Policies guaranteeing jobs doesn’t help; they need the basis for careers and life first and all the rest will follow with existing laws in place being enforced and a quality educated population.
Having kids just for the sake of it is the stupidest thing I could possibly imagine. This fool has no education to speak of on his own and this idea is insane. There are already too many kids raising kids who were never even raised themselves.
We love laughing at Donald trump and his stupidity but politicians this foolish would be fired, locked up or shot in most parts of the world.
Shaking my head as everything starts to circle the drain
Running for Public Office: Mr. Fertility Saunders.
I have one, make decent money and it is difficult.
Lots in Cayman society would need improvement for me to bring more kids into it.
True!
MLA Chris Saunders (BTW) has said that Caymanians need to “make more children” to prevent the country from getting into future trouble as a result of a declining birth rate.
And please let it be with other Caymanian partners.. not paper Caymanians, not Jamaicans, not Hondurans, not Filipinos, not Americans, more Cayman children from “Caymanian couples”
Thank you and that is all. Carry on.
@ 7.32 Yeah let’s become a Caribbean Tristan De Cuhna. Inbred, insular and cut off from reality. The very thing that makes the Caribbean and Cayman so interesting is the diversity. Stupid comment but not surprising.
We already there.
Interesting doesn’t mean ethical. One of many things Cayman Islands is recognized for is it’s native people. The Caymanian heritage, history and, not diversity like your simple pea brain has put it.
So disrespectful and uninformed. How dare you describe people in that manner from a place you know nothing about. It’s the same way people erroneously described and thought of the Cayman Islands and people when we were “the islands that times forgot.” The last time documentary’s I watched shows the people of St. Helena, Tristan and ascension to be quite content and happy with their way of life. The same cannot be said of the Cayman Islands today. Yes, some people love the diversity, whatever that prevents them from acknowledging and coming into contact with anything remotely ‘caymanian.’
Hahaha, the jokes on you. Soon I’ll be welcoming my “half breed” child with my wife. I’m Caymanian, she’s Jamaican. Best woman I’ve ever meet, mother loves her, I love her. That’s all that really matters, love. Sorry you missed out on the same based on how you’re speaking. O we can more than afford this child, she’s a teacher and I work in tech. The words of my ppl disgust me sometimes.
I don’t see anything wrong with your words, 8:59, but I think MLA Saunders is playing with less than a full deck. I will NOT be voting for him in the next election.
Agree 100%
It’s the actions that disgust me more.
Don’t rejoice too soon joe, its always sweet bliss in the beginning…
So nice to see comments like this. Blessings, 50+ more years of wedding bliss.
You’re a racist asshat. You realize this country had an inbreeding problem not that long ago right? Please keep your genes out of the pool…there is no lifeguard
“Not Jamaicans” would not be a part of Chris Saunders plan.
Let’s be frank. Look at our elders. Well, they did okay, but there were little problems sometimes in our general gene pond. I don’t think it makes a whit of difference from where the genes that are dubbed “Caymanian” come from.
What is important is that those people who are dubbed “Caymanian” can provide for themselves and their children. That is the way in which a culture progresses.
WOW! WELL DONE CHRIS! You have single-handedly united the whole Cayman population with your stupid comment!
All the thumbs up agreeing your idea is probably one of the stupidest ever and we have had a lot to choose from.
Who does this man mean by Caymanian?
I WAS BORN HERE. I have a business here that employs Caymanians and I spend and invest nearly every dollar I make in the Cayman Islands.
And yet, I am the victim of racist, xenophobic “Caymanians” who tell me to go back home where I came from.
Can someone explain this to me? This place is ass backward
All while Saunders saunters around with a Jamaican accent saying “I man born ya”. Nothing wrong with that. Heaven forbid you are from here but have British, Canadian, Irish or any other accent though.
You aren’t the problem. You hire Caymanians and respect your home.
Who tells you to go back home, and more importantly, why do you listen to people who are jealous of your success?
Agree with this comment 100%.
What others think of me is none of my business. I have zero control over their thoughts.
I do have control over my response- that is 100% my responsibility.
if you do have a kid….just hope it grows up smarter than chris saunders.
6.25am We have more than enough kids, but they are the ones that end up in curry.
Only someone who is blinded by the dangeros combination of religion and privilege can come up with something like that in a time like this.
People cant pay their health insurance and buy food (i guess its not an issue for this MLA) and what youb got for them is: “have more kids”??
There are people pregnant right now with no health insurance, only because your government promised to pay it for them in May and just didnt do it!
MLA salaries are all fine and paid, in case you where worried (maybe they should have more kids!!)
Wrong approach Chris. You should have suggested that Government bring back a Caymanian Protection Law. As part of that law would be a requirement to restrict Cayman Status grants to a percentage of the number of Caymanian babies born the year previous.Also a clause requiring a mandatory break in employment for all permit holders so as to reduce the number of workers that qualify for PRV or status.
If we don’t do this we will find that in a couple more years there will be more expats than native Caymanians voting in our elections and choosing their own Government. So Chris why not fight for this instead.
4:27 I wish I could like your comment 1000 times! This is so needed and would be a much more beneficial avenue for our Government to explore.
Yes, yes and YES! Love this comment
WTF. I have no words. So ignorant.
Oh boy, I doubt my caymanian wife will have kids I can’t even get to first base
I laugh!
Never thought the incel movement would make it to Cayman.
Caycels lol
More Kids!!!!
Maybe if everybody was being given (cause you know they don’t really work or get it honestly) money like they were it would be easy.
The local kids cannot get jobs now because the workpermits and people like him that won’t hire them.
He wants people to have more kids so he can make more money off their backs to pay for his lavish lifestyle.
You all in the house need to come to reality. But alas KARMA will deal with you all and you can’t run or buy your way out of that.. So best of luck with what time you have left.
Something COVID 19 has shown is poor leadership (across the world), and the different “realities” for people, while the majority is still struggling to get back on their feet, some (like most politicians) that would never have the same needs as the regular citizens, can only “think” and react as their reality allows them to do …
They make over 100k a year. We shouldn’t be surprised that they’re out of touch with the needs of the common man.
Legalize cannabis. This would be a booming local (and eventually tourist) industry. Imagine one lil boat out of 892 a year ga a ton of herb on it. Thousands of consumers.
I honestly cannot believe these words, these sentences, came out of his mouth. Are you serious. Is this guy for real. Ummmm, excuse Mr clueless there’s this virus thingy going on all around the world at the moment causing some real economic issues, you may have heard about it, so right now I’m thinking this isn’t a concern for government..
Oh, by the way you may want to fix the whole suspended medical insurance stuff that’s going on before going on your baby-making crusade. Unless you expect those affected to just give birth on the beach ??
Just listen to him and Seymour. God help us and that is the words of an atheist
No lie! If ever there was a MLA who should represent the need for not procreation we have found him.
You are a total idiot!!
To be fair, maybe this is the kickoff that’s needed. Increased maternity leave is but one piece of the puzzle.
Today I had a customer leave a toddler and an infant unattended in a running vehicle. Really, we need more of these people reproducing?
What people? Caymanians?
Probably one of you expats. Love to leave your kids unattended and doing whatever they please.
11:46 could not agree more, see them doing that all the time in Camana bay. No behavior at all, parents too busy shopping or drinking to actually parent. Vast majority, expats.
No man. They leave them with their Filipino nannies while they do yoga and coffee and talk about expensive vacations and where theyre going to order dinner from because they didnt learn squat from their $120 per couple Bon Vivant cooking class.
Please state which nationality of expat you are singling out….
So many of the baby makers are uneducated teenagers supported by the NAU. Are we supposed to support them? Teach them? Help them to love a productive life?
WTF kind of idea is this? We need free birth control for anyone over 12. Because, trust me that is when they start screwing around , with their absentee parents off not being parents. My niece in on her third kid. All of them watched by the grandmother. She has no job, no future, no decent education, she is 20 years old, and will be a burden on society for the rest of her life because she has selfish parents who never looked an inch past there own selfish needs.
Sorry to say but that is true.
Growth for growth’s sake is a dead end path. What is the goal? How many Caymanians is enough? You can’t hide incompetent governance behind growth forever. So how many? 100k? 500k? A million people on Grand Cayman?
We don’t have the schools, landfill, environmental protections, or urban planning in place for the current population.
How about working toward quality of life for all rather than quantity of bodies?
#lame
Not to worry Chris. The numbers of Caymanians is actually increasing – the number of those qualifying each year for status easily makes up for the low birth rate 😉
7.07pm Do tell me how many grants of status were made in the last 3 years?. Fortunately the West Bay bushman is no longer in charge.
Bush apparently not in charge, but him fren still benefit from his influence.
The ppm led coalition has granted more PR applications and Status than the infamous status grants done by Bush. Think about that ! We will very soon no longer Have political power and we have already lost economic power
Unwanted kids = future crime.
We need WAY more birth control.
Already 20 years too late.
Thak God that all comments so far have disagreed with Mr. Saunders’ reckless, very-poorly considered, and outrageous comments – and for all the right reasons!
I was born in Cayman in the latter half of the 1950s so I’ve seen quite a number of changes in our society. No one is more in favour of protecting and preserving whatever Caymanian “culture” remains from my generation that myself. I gather this may have been Mr. Saunders’ on considertaion before spouting his BS publicly. Cayman is what is is now and we accept it and perhaps try to contain what ahd how we can to slow it becoming “less Caymanian”.
But we are already swamped with the “babies-having-babies” syndrome, absentee parents, parents who can’t afford more kids but keep having them (not like some of the commentators) – all of this leading to rising social problems, crime and associated costs to the public purse and the indelible effects on the fabrics of our society.
Chris Saunders if this is the best you can off please don’t run again and focus on serious efforts to reduce our cost of living so people (including those with families) can survive AND prosper. Mr. Saunders, hope you read all these comments and pay attention to them. Can you imagine how heart-wrenching a decision it is for the wiser people who would wish to start families but decide not to, simply because they can’t afford to??!!
This probably why they hate the gays.
Ironic though because you can’t expect to tell a gay person to suddenly be a straight Christian and go procreate.
You can be gay and be a parent I know a lot who are. Gay couples adopt and give loving homes too.
Sorry, I get you but adopting doesn’t +1 to the population. By all means, if a child needs a home I respect those who do though.
Surrogate mother😉
Actually it can if you adopt from another country. I had started the process of international adoption (not actually matched with a child) when my financial circumstances changed and I felt I was unable to support another child and stopped the process.
Nah, you must be wrong – I heard they eat babies
I can barely afford to keep electricity on in my own islands -bought out by people looking points for residency – and this man wants me to go breed with zero incentives.
Did you even think before presenting this motion, Chris?
Did he ever think, PERIOD!
It’s sad that 380 Caymanians determined they had no better choice among the four candidates that ran. Too many districts, Too dense a field. Caymanians need to get organized and revamp our Elections Law before 2021. Reduce the number of districts, reduce the unproductive overhead costs, scrap party system and private caucus, delete grandparent requirements, bring back opposition shadow government, debate in LA and junk the crony boards. Do it for the 380.
I would like to see this also but it will never happen.
CPR demonstrated that: given enough advertising and prodding, Caymanians can (reluctantly) get organized. The problem right now is that not enough Caymanians really understand that the Elections Law already dooms us to another self-interested power-sharing repeat, with many of the same cast…and another DART deal on a 50 story high rise…another port negotiation…etc etc. Round and round we go. Let’s fix the problem by forcing a new era of compliance and transparency.
Multi-seat constituencies and proportional voting. Gets rid of the dross,
5.21pm You are quite right about the field being dense, there are not nearly enough intelligent candidates to go round.
Should probably get themselves jobs first.
I’m a young Caymanian in my 20s married to another Caymanian.
Wanna know why we chose not to have kids?
How the F**K you expect us to survive with 1-2 kids and paying rent or mortgage on the average wage of 20-30 year old Caymanians?!!
If unna never had a million low wage foreign workers here driving up rent and property costs (let’s give them points towards PR for buying up our birthright land therefore increasing demand, GREAT IDEA YOU FOOLS), maybe then I’d have income left over to support a child.
As a 30 year old Caymanian who makes ends meet with my significant other, the cost of living here is the biggest deterrent to having kids. Housing is expensive, food is expensive and schools… LOL its a private school life for my kid because I will chop off my foot if my child is going into government school.
If you want that fertility rate up, try and make it so that people will want to raise kids in the system your are helping to create/maintain.
Well said! You hit the nail on the head. These politicians are clueless..
But you vote them in
I wonder if we can vote them OUT?
“give businesses time to plan” For future new job vacancy advert’ “women of child bearing age need not apply”!!
Taking a page out of Putin’s songbook? That’s what he’s been pushing recently.
The whole world is facing problems that have been exacerbated by over-population, and this idiot is encouraging (and boasting) about even more breeding???!!!
You’re misinformed.
We can not afford to have them!! I’m 36, childless, own a 1 bed apartment, make 55k annually, have a few thousand in savings and I don’t think I can afford to have a child. The average Caymanian is not even making what I make so how can you think that having more children is possible??
If you want to encourage the Caymanian population growth then government not only has to fix the education system and other support systems but also has to offer incentive programs like mortgage breaks and family rates for certain services in addition to expanding the maternity leave policy.
Did he forget that Cayman is the most expensive country/territory to live in, in the world!
Of course, maternity leave should be the same for every expectant mother, as well as for people who adopt kids, but that is just a tiny drop in the bucket.
When I first came to Cayman I thought, hmmm, Christian community…must be big on family so they must have a generous maternity leave allowance. Was I ever shocked to find out the truth! Cayman isn’t about family at all, it’s about making as much money as possible, pretending you are a Christian on Sundays and exploiting foreign labour to the max to meet selfish goals!
You want more kids? More kids that can actually be cared for properly and well educated? Put your money where your mouth is. Cayman is overflowing with cash or was, and will be again. Maternity leave should be the same as, if not better than, what is available in the UK, Canada or the rest of Europe.
Here’s a solution:
1. Make ALL schools a public/private partnership. No two-tier system.
2. Fund the schools properly and make sure there are enough spaces. Educating the next generation is everyone’s responsibility so everyone should pay into the cause, even people without kids. So, there should be an education fee, duty, whatever you want to call it (except “tax” because if you did that the world would apparently collapse…oh wait, it did and we are still here!). I already pay some stupid stamp duty fee for spending my own money from my own bank account on a monthly basis so, if the government can do that then they can create a “fee” or a “duty” to cover the cost of a decent education for everyone.
3. On top of the educational fee or duty, have parents with kids in school pay a little extra as a small percentage of their gross income. This should be very small but significant enough to keep parents engaged. Families with incomes under a certain level should not have to pay an extra fee.
4. Make a law protecting jobs for parents on maternity/paternity leave for 18 months. Make sure they get paid a decent minimum while on leave.
5. Make early childcare a public/private partnership and ensure there are enough spots for all these new babies you want!
Do these things and at least you have a good start.
Oh, and take a bulldozer to UCCI and build a proper university campus which is a satellite campus of a proper university like the University of Florida, the University of Nottingham or the University of Toronto. As part of the same campus have a college for trades and 2-year diploma programs. By partnering with a proper university you get good standards, you can cycle professors through on secondments along with some permanent staff, you have the huge tech support and systems of the “mother” university and a graduate can actually get a degree/diploma/certificate that means something outside the sphere of the Government Administration Build (GAB).
Sorry for being a little long winded here but this article really got my hackles up.
He should have brought a motion asking the government to try bring down the cost of living or increase the minimum wage by the end of 2021!
Make a living wage!!! CI$9.00 per hour = $1,512 per month x 2 adults (CI$3,024) so a family can afford a two bed apartment, a car, and groceries.
Time is NOW when our population is down to raise up our community and stop the greed of cheap labour for big business and support our own.
Be a better place to live, work, and play?
What an ass!
You mean Jackass
What an irresponsible statement encouraging people “to make more children” .
NAU is already suffering the consequences of careless reproduction by people who cannot afford to feed themselves, let alone their children.
C’mon Mr Saunders you should be encouraging your people to get better educated to make better choices, not making more economic dependants.
Don’t have kids if you can’t afford them. They are expensive and once you have them they are a priority. And what do you count as “Caymanian”? I was born here but I bet I’m not what you had in mind when you want Caymaninas to procreate.
3.27…I think you may have identified an agenda that dares not speak it’s name.
Carl Gordon almost said the same them many years ago, as head of the “Caymanian Protection Board”?
Is he having a laugh? Workaday Caymanians like myself are having tremendous difficulty even finding, let alone affording, a moderately priced decent family home, and he wants us to make more children?
If maternity leave was the only real issue here.
Hungary:
– families given generous subsidies to buy or build new homes, and the subsidies scale up based on their marital status and the number of children they had.
-free fertility treatment to couples
Russia:
-Maternity capital for each born child
-subsidy per family 616,617 rubles ($8,828 today)
-Welfare benefits for children aged three to seven in low-income families and free school meals will be provided for the first four years of school
-Russian mothers receive 140 days of maternity leave at full salary
-Mothers can remain on leave for a year-and-a-half, but only at 40 percent of their salary.
-Mothers can stay on leave for up to three years without worrying about losing their jobs.
Finland:
-a private hospital room for three days with husband and new baby, a day fee for a hospital stay costs about $42
-the maternity grant that gives new parents a box filled with 63 items for a new baby
-Substantial parental leave : an equal quota of 164 paid days to each parent and allows people to transfer 69 days to one another if need be. (Single parents get double the parental quota.) Pregnant parents also get an extra month before they go on parental leave.
Maternity leave isn’t this issue because the people here having kids are not employed. It is the lowest end educationally and economically. They go on NAU, get money, go out and get knocked up again, and ignore their responsibilities. They give up children to the system, then turn up pregnant a few months later. No consequences for them.
Only have children if you can afford them, practice safe sex otherwise. There are already too many children in less than ideal living situations here, look at how many receive lunch support at the schools if you don’t believe me.
Agreed that nobody should be having kids just because novice MLA Chris Saunders has awoken after four years and proclaims us to. We already have so many recreational deadbeat baby-makers here owing years of support, so some basic parameters need to apply, importantly:
1. Be in a committed relationship, preferably, over a year.
2. Both want to experience the awe, wonder, and headaches of having kids.
3. Both want to have kids with that other person.
4. Plan the timing for that family…and that should include committing to love and support those offspring through “parenting” for as long as you both shall live.
If you have all of those, you make do on the money part, and the kids get lunch because daddy doesn’t consume child support payments in the VIP and/or pretending to be a playah. He willingly foregoes the 35lbs of brass jewelry, the Rolex, and the pirate coin necklace so that Little Willy can get his tenders. All is well.
I would agree, just add have enough money to provide your child a chance at a decent life.
I. E. Enough money to send them to St. Ignatius or Prep. If you can’t afford a private school education on this island your child’s chance of success is very small.
The headline is amongst the most irresponsible and dangerous statements I have an MLA make, and that is saying something! That last thing Cayman needs is more children. We are incapable of educating and paying for the ones we already have!
3.20 “irresponsible” is too kind…Stupid, just plain stupid is more like it.
And in the middle of a pandemic when people are supposed to be social distancing. What a comment.
Before you advocate to procreate to increase the indigenous population, you should put a law in place that obligates fathers to a support and educate their children.
Very good idea, and also a law that obligates mothers to allow the fathers to be a part of the child’s life should be established. While I know that some fathers are very absent, I also know that some fathers want to be there and the mother’s push them away curse them out and deny them time with their child. In the end the father’s become frustrated and some stop trying completely. I’m a female so I know how women get and I’m currently going through it with my fiance.
Great idea Chris, the system cannot support the kids that we currently have. Delinquent parents, baby mamas and papas, disenfranchised youths are just a few reasons this is a very bad idea. The public education system has failed and is failing still. Before encouraging Caymanians to procreate more try fixing what gives them and Cayman a real future where real leaders are produced.
Anyway it might work for yours and your fellow politricians ends to keep the local population, less competitive impoverished, and unskilled. After all the government surely needs those work permit dollars.
Caymanians cannot educate the children they currently produce.
So if the private sector maternity benefit is increased to match the civil service maternity benefit, this will encourage Caymanians to have more children? Another few weeks of pay is enough to offset the cost of having another child?
Does this guy really have a finance background?
Glad Chris is finally showing that having an financial’ back ground‘ doesn’t mean you are intelligent or have common sense. Please vote carefully next year. Is this the sort of leader we need? I’m a Red Bay voter and I’m concerned about my constituency too. Can we please get some qualified runners in 2021?
The problem is single member constituencies, with a first past the post / winner take all/ one “man” (as women don’t count), one vote… no choice and a low vote threshold so that we end up with the likes of these getting elected.
MULTI-SEAT CONSTITUENCIES, PLEASE!!!!
Island wide elections with the top 19 forming government is my proposal.
Who is going to pay to raise these additional children?
You and your fellow politicians? I think not!!!!
This is nonsense. If anything Caymanians should learn how to properly raise the children they already have! No more!
I don’t think maternity leave is the issue. What we have is too many people having children who don’t have jobs, have never had jobs, and think it is ok to have lots of children and expect the government to feed and house them.
More baby daddy is the last thing we need. Don’t encourage them Chris.
More children isn’t the answer! That’s like putting lipstick on a pig. Fix the schools, fix them now because all you get are uneducated single mothers and baby daddies. Once we have an educated new generation then you will have more children that are brought up in good homes. Break the cycle, don’t award a broken system.
Very well said!
There is a whole lot in this issue and I would note that Mr. Saunders was previously on record about too many people being in Cayman.
I guess the issue comes back to how do you define what a Caymanian is. As Driftwood I’m sure my kids don’t count.