CIG spends people’s cash to stop people’s vote
Cayman cruise ship passengers visit George Town
(CNS): Government has not yet revealed how much public cash it has been spending on promoting its vision for cruise berthing facilities in George Town and trying to dissuade people from signing the petition for a people-initiated referendum on the topic. Campaigners who believe the people should have a say in this process are concerned that the Unity government is using the people’s money to try to stop them. As the tendering process edges towards a final decision on who will develop this huge infrastructure project, the premier has stated on a number of occasions that a referendum would derail the project.
As volunteers are now going door to door with the petition, which has been signed so far by more than 4,000 people, the target number of 5,280 names is well in sight. But some of those involved in the referendum campaign have raised their concerns that government is undermining the people’s democratic right to a vote by trying to prevent people from signing the petition and using taxpayers’ money to do it.
Government has spent money on radio, television and newspaper advertisements and has been pushing an online campaign, especially on Facebook, that is labelling those who sign the petition as anti-tourism in an effort to galvanize its supporters not to sign.
Support Our Tourism, a campaign financed by the Ministry of Tourism, continues to promote positions and figures that are contradicted by the government’s own reports as well as other industry-based information. From the exaggerated time ships will spend in the port to the amount cruise ship passengers actually spend on shore, government is misleading the public on several issues and using the public coffers to do it.
Emphatically opposed to the idea of a national ballot on the issue, Premier Alden McLaughlin has stated that the government already has a mandate because it was elected to office following the 2017 elections, having campaigned on a port — an argument that has been largely called into question.
How much government has spent trying to prevent people signing the petition has not been revealed, but CNS understands that a number of FOI requests have been made seeking that information.
Campaigners who are opposed to the cruise facility have argued that a referendum is the only way for government to know if there is real support for this project, given the significant issues that the public has recently been made aware of which appear to contradict the government’s claims about why the facility is needed.
Two major cruise lines have confirmed that, although they will not bring mega cruise ships here because they will not tender, they have no intention of pulling other ships from George Town and Cayman will always be a destination of choice for their passengers.
Industry reports and documentation have also confirmed that only a small percentage of the ships on the order books over the next decade are Oasis-class ships.
Meanwhile, Cayman has had record-breaking cruise arrival numbers this summer. In its own recently published National Tourism Plan, the Department of Tourism highlighted the strains already being placed on some of Cayman’s attractions and infrastructure. It pointed to the difficulty on busy cruise days of managing passenger numbers even now — while the government is hoping that around 700,000 more year will come once the country has berthing facilities, with no apparent plan to deal with this increase.
The government has insisted that the redesigned plans will reduce the environmental impact, but the truth is the tourism ministry opted for a design that reduces the damage by around only 7%. This means that many acres of hugely significant and pristine coral reefs remain under threat, not just in the dredging footprint but much further afield as a result of the movement of silt and sediment. The plans also place several wrecks that have cultural importance under threat.
Government is also using misleading figures about the number of tourism jobs that it claims will be lost if the project does not go ahead. Many of the 4,000 workers who government says depend on tourism are on work permits, and many of them also service the growing and far more lucrative overnight business.
As well as scepticism about the justifications for the project, suspicions about its financing remains a problem for government. Government claims it will not pay for it, but this has been challenged by referendum supporters and the opposition, who point out that cash currently collected from passenger fees and go into public coffers will likely go to the developer.
So far government has not stated how the financing model for this project will work, who will really own the facility once its finished and who in the end will benefit and who will lose. While the price tag has been estimated to be around $200 million, many people believe that it will be far more.
Visit the Cruise Port Referendum Facebook page.
Category: development, Government Finance, Local News, Politics
The amount the government is spending is infinitesimal compared to the benefits of building the port. They’re spending money to help and protect Cayman, which is their job.
Like they have ever protected cayman.
I am a Caymanian. I am by no means wealthy, but I do well enough to afford to travel. I’ve seen the beaches of several major tourist destinations. Destinations that the Cayman Islands competes with for tourism dollars. I’ve been to beaches in the Scotland, I’ve been to beaches in the north of France and the French Mediterranean coast. I’ve been to beaches in Spain. I’ve been to beaches of Nothern Germany on the West coast and the Baltic Sea. I’ve been to beaches of the Amalfi Coast, Sicily and Capri. I’ve been to beaches of the Greek Isles of Santorini, Naxos and Mykonos. All these beaches that I have seen with my own eyes cannot compare with Seven Mile Beach. While I’m sure there are more beautiful beaches in the world, what we have is a beach that is very special. On SMB, you can wade into the water to your neck, look down, and still see your feet. That is rare and special. The sand of SMB is white and granular, the water is clear and warm and calm, without silt and grass and stones. If we allow the GT Harbour to be dredged, the pristine beauty of SMB will be gone. Where do you think the crap from dredging will go? Out to sea? No. The dredging will produce debris that will settle on the west side dive sites, killing the coral, driving away marine life. The debris will wind up on SMB. The dredging of GT Harbour to build cruise piers is a bad idea. And it should be fought at all costs in order to save our beautiful and unique SMB.
11:20 would you explain, if a boat man engine fail in G Town he will probably end up in Mexico and not the 7 mile Beach?
It’s plain and simple, if you sign the petition you are voting against cruise and against the cruise dock and against thousands of caymanians jobs
It’s plain and simple you’re a f**king idiot and a troll.
1:50 ‘thousands of caymanians jobs’? How do you figure that? The reality is that stay-over tourism will always produce more real employment that the cruise ships ever could and you can’t have both – they don’t co-exist and never have done.
Stayover tourism doesn’t really help most Caymanians. It helps hotels, airlines, car rentals,Bars and Restaurants, Red sail sports, dive companies. Who mostly hire foreigners on work permit.
Truthfully neither does cruise tourists, they benefit the tour operators and a select few business mostly owned by a few people/families.
And all of whom pay a fortune in tourist tax, work permits, and duty on fuel, food, electricity , water – all of which goes to government coffers to pay for everything from our education system to infrastructure.
That’s right because the hotels don’t pay any of that.. f**king idiot.
You need to get out more. It might help you be less gullible. I am sure that my job is being counted as one of those thousands, but the cruise business contributes less than hotel business and I would never say that my job is dependent on cruise tourism. I wouldn’t want to see the cruise ships dry up totally, but they aren’t going anywhere in a hurry. What it means is more passengers crammed into a 6 month window and this is not the answer to everyone’s prayers – more cruise ship passengers around GT deters hotel shoppers. At that stage my job WOULD become dependent on cruise shippers, who do spend less in general. Which would I prefer? A balance of both and this is realistically not what Government are telling us we are going to get.
Liar liar liar liar X 1,000.
It’s plain and simple, if you sign the petition you are voting against cruise and against the cruise dock and against thousands of work permit jobs
– there fixed it for you!
ha ha ha ..tha wa unna get…vote ????them in next time you here!!????
Good article. Attempts to stop the referendum from succeeding not only include the Ministry of Tourism’s blatant support for the Cardinal Avenue driven pro port lobbyists, but also includes the refusal by both Kirk and Foster supermarket’s from allowing the people’s initiated referendum to be promoted outside their venues. Guess protecting family interests comes way before protecting the Cayman Islands.
so let me see if I can get this straight. The government is under fire because they ‘don’t communicate’ enough. ‘don’t tell us enough’. ‘hide in the back and don’t say anything’. So when they put up a facebook page, hold a public meeting and run a few ads in the paper now they are trying to scare people and everyone is up in arms?
this is an absolute nonsense. I hope that the anti-group do not succeed because if they do, there is going to be a massive negative change felt by everyone in this country. Even those rich folks who don’t care about the people who drive taxis and tour buses, or take people out on boats for a living. but they will start to care when hundreds of unemployed people get desperate.
this whole argument is about those who ‘have; wanting to haul the ladder up, leaving the others behind, because they are inconvenienced by cruise shippers walking around in George Town. what a shame.
We need to be building each other up, and looking after each other.
“so let me see if I can get this straight. The government is under fire because they ‘don’t communicate’ enough. ‘don’t tell us enough’. ‘hide in the back and don’t say anything’. So when they put up a facebook page, hold a public meeting and run a few ads in the paper now they are trying to scare people and everyone is up in arms?”
I’m sorry but you are clueless on what is going on. The CIG has done all those things but the truth is they have said virtually nothing of significance or importance. Anyone can get up before a group of people and talk for an hour and say absolutely nothing. The CIG has held their meetings, created their facebook page but the answers to the questions the people are wanting? We are still waiting for them.
The ads and the facebook page is to persuade the people to NOT exercise their democratic right in having a say in what goes on in our country. That is the shame in the matter because they obviously have something to hide. That is what the anti-people are upset about. The cruise companies have said they won’t be pulling boats from here. all they will do is not send 2 boats here because of they don’t want to tender the Oasis class ships.
The real negative change is going to be felt in the stay over tourists who despite their lack of numbers, spend more in Cayman. Over crowded beaches will sway peoples choices which will affect the hotel industry and that is where you will see hundreds of people being unemployed.
If you saw the big picture on how the CIG is handling this, you would be upset too.
Well that is just untrue. I am VERY well informed on this subject, thank you very much. I disagree with you is all.
The reason you are not getting the information you are looking for is because THEY DON’T HAVE IT YET! This was the whole point of the meeting and of what the government is saying. They are in the middle of a procurement process, where this information is being gathered!
Why do people keep saying that government is not being transparent when the answer is all the same – as soon as they have it, I am sure you will be the first to know.
“The reason you are not getting the information you are looking for is because THEY DON’T HAVE IT”
I’m sorry did you type that with a straight face? If you are down to 3 bidders, they have to have submitted proposals to be one of the final 3 bidders so I call BS on the government not having any information. You don’t have a short list of bidders without proposals, that is common sense or if it is CIG’s case.. Profoundly bad business.
@4:02 How can you have bidders and not have the bids? That’s how a choice is made during bidding, a group of companies send in their proposals and the government decides which one to choose and considering they are down to 3 bidders with one “preferred bidder”. I think it’s safe to say they have it and now they need to show it.
Folk driving those Taxis are not poor trust me.
W O W I’ve just had time to sit and read the article- AND all the comments. It leads me to thoughtfully contemplate that the petition can likely now get well in excess of the necessay 25% voting electorate! Government is sadly unresponsive, I’ve had no response from my elected MLA concerning the costs of this project and when posing questions to the Minister of Environment he seems to not have the knowledge and generally a rather lackluster approach to the project- it’s an utter shambles but this is not some little playground problem, it’s very SERIOUS Cayman and I hope that everyone is paying attention!
We had a petition from West Bay that had 4000 people who signed to stop the closing of the west bay road going through Kimpton Inn. Remember that? Then when the 4 lane was opened they changed their mind. Can you imagine if they had stopped it? Because Grand father used to walk or go by horseback across there? Look at the domino effect by closing the road? A new hotel and condo, Kaboo event, A new headquarters for Red Sail Diving and a completed 4 lane highway. “What you wish for may not be what you get”
7:45 the West Bay people have their mouths shut now but they are happy that the Government did not pay there petition any mind
when Mr. Dart is finish with his plans they will have the greatest District of all
Yeah too bad it won’t be for them anymore.
child talk
And you Sir/Madam have the naivety of a child.
seriously? child talk? it’s truth talk.. wake up and see what is going on around you.
7:45P – You are full of Shite. Nobody changed their mind about that road being closed. $$$ won plain and simple.
The NRA Agreement (through three versions) were negotiated in the backroom – the same kind of deal that is clearly in motion now with the Port.
And I hope that that motivates people to sign the petition – by the time action was taken on the WBR it was decided it was too late and it was a fait accompli. This shouldn’t have been able to happen that time and light needs to be shone in the dark corners of this deal because it is even scarier than the WBR deal and may involve some of the same players. Instead of Government gladly remaining transparent on all aspects of this huge deal, there is obfuscation and half truths. Something stinks and in this case (for once) it isn’t the dump.
yes you blind idiot I would like to see you and friends trying to get out
of West Bay now, on that little piece of pot hole road with 3 thousand
cars in front !
what goes on in the back room is not for you all to worry about
you will be silent and happy after !
Funny you say that, Whose company made the most money from that new 4 lane highway? Anybody remember?……… Who’s there?……. Is that you? Oh no say it ain’t so.
10:11 instead of thinking of other people money think what you can do with
yours
the type of road we have now from G. Town to Morgans Harbour in West Bay was a long dream
I am giving thanks to all that made it possible, don’t speed and be Happy.
actually the real concern was not about the new road, but the closing of the old one…there was zero justification for closing that part of west bay road, most countries in the world have hotels on one side and the beach on the other side of a road…all the closing did was increase daddy darts land value, nothing else
how old will you be before you realize nothing comes free.
Nothing comes free but nothing takes freely and how old will YOU be when you realize what was given was too much?
So you think the Kaboo event is good?? This tells me all I need to know.
I knows nothing about Kaboo but I am free to know or not know.
Truly moronic how the government and port supporters claim to have a mandate and claims public support on the project but then spends public funds to spread misinformation on the issue trying to sway Caymanians from voting
Either you have a mandate and public support and you are willing to prove it with a referendum
Or you know that you don’t have public support, have no mandate and still want to carry the project through in spite of the people’s opinion
It can’t be both
I signed the petition, not necessarily to oppose the dock, but to force the Government to provide more transparency regarding the cost/benefit/environmental analysis.
so where is the line drawn for Government business?
Fundamentally, they are public SERVANTS, not MASTERS. Their egos are writing cheques their butts can’t cash.
you fool if they were servants you would not have your problem, next time at the polls think what you are doing.
By signing the petition even if you support the dock you are stopping the project from going forward.
It’s like saying the operation was successful but the patient died!
@11:10 Why not let the referendum go through and the hundreds of millions of Caymanians you and the CIG seem to think are in favor of the port can come out and vote yes for it and settle the issue once and for all.
if we don’t find time to sign the petition that will be a yes!
Unless the referendum is brought by those smart enough to know a referendum is needed and then you will be forces to vote yes.
So when the referendum does through I bet you find the time then.
I hope that everyone on the Islands can now see the value of the pier and those politicians who are trying to push this project down the throats of everyone and destroy the future of the Islands . Maybe $2.0 value
Sorry Ron but I think you would be getting some change back with your $2.
CAYMANIANS, WAKE UP! Your government is spending PUBLIC FUNDS to run advertisements that are incredibly misleading. Why are the ads on the radio stating that “It is a myth that Cayman does not need cruise tourism”?? Those that are calling for a referendum have NEVER said that cruise tourism is not important!! Your government is intentionally trying to mislead you into thinking that those people calling for a referendum do not support cruise tourism. This is incredibly disingenuous on the part of the government. If they would do that, intentionally trying to mislead the people, then why should they be trusted??
Of course the Cayman Islands needs cruise tourism. No one has ever disputed that. The question is whether the Cayman Islands needs to build expensive cruise berthing piers for the new mega-cruise ships. The existing cruise ships will continue to come here anyway!
Make no mistake, ANY dredging in the harbour will ruin the dive sites on the west side. ANY dredging in the harbour will wash up on Seven Mile Beach. ANY dredging in the harbour will effect the wave action on the west side and could result in horrible and permanent beach erosion! Sign the petition Caymanians, and at least you will have a say in what happens to YOUR Country!!
remember next time you go to the polls is to give somebody your say!
I think you miss the point of democracy. Just because we elect people does not mean that they are not accountable to the people after they win the election. If we feel that they are not listening to us, then of course we are allowed to bring a referendum of national importance. In case you didn’t know spending millions of dollars, destroying our reefs, increasing traffic and subsequently crime are all issues of national importance. So yes, we will have our say in the referendum which is constitutionally allowed. Also, this current (coalition) government put the right to referendum in the constitution and also pushed One Man One Vote. It’s funny how quickly we forget some of this.
the only reason a country should not have an air port and a sea port is if they are too poor to have one !
True Alaw but last time I checked.. we had one of each..
if you have one of each what is the petition for?
So every county in ICAO then?
It is also a myth that only 2 mega ships will bypass grand cayman. So your claim that the existing cruise ships will continue to come here anyways is false.
What You and the anti port people fail to understand is that the smaller ships are being REPLACED by the bigger ships. They are not going to be working alongside each other so small ones come here and big ones go to Islands where they have berthing.
Make no mistake, government spent millions on studies and research by some of the best companies in the world. What are YOUR credentials to challenge the findings of the experts?
Oh yes, all those smaller ships are going to be replaced by the dozens of mega ships currently in prod..HAHAHA sorry couldn’t keep a straight face and type. Have you seen the book orders for cruise ships? There are less than a handful of mega ships being built. The smaller ones are going no where.
how come nobody remembers the part where the CEOS for the cruise lines
says “one day all the small ships will head for the scrap yard”
Technically at some point ALL ships go to the scrap yard.
Keep drinking the kool aid.
Somebody call JG Wentworth, “It’s my money and I want it now!”
so what about the garbage incenerator…govt sign deal that we would be taxed to cover maintenance and other costs…including normal operational…i was told? ppm just squandering more poor people money? ahoy maties…yo all driving with yur eyes close!!!????
How come the so called environmentalists are not all over the dump project? Where is the EIA for the dump?
The dump contract is signed and still no EIA, but that seems to be fine with the environmentalists.
I guess because the piers will spoil the view from their south sound mansions and the dump won’t, the dump doesn’t matter.
Priceless!!!!! lol
People keep voting them in!!!! lol
Well lucky I have dual passports to checkout when the sh#t hits the fan.
Well, that’s just it…they were actually voted out, yet slithered and back-stabbed themselves back into the cockpit anyway. We should have a coalition of independents running the country, instead, those folks are relegated to the back-bench and denied participation in the LA.
coalition of independents which one will you choose for Premier?
That should have been for them to decide amongst themselves. The Premier’s job is NOT to be an Authoritarian or Autocrat, they are simply a renamed version of “the leader of gov’t business”, based on a Cabinet coalition that should have been comprised of Independent Victors from the Election – doing the work demanded of the people – not of their egos, wallets, and/or conflicted partners.
sir where were you during the elections, don’t tell me your memory is that bad that you cant remember
why we end up with the present Government
you are missing the point they could not, like you said “decide amongst themselves”
No we need to pass a law that says politicians need to be one and done or 2 and done. Wait what am I saying, we have no politicians, not dedicated professional ones like almost every other country in the world. We have part time want to be’s.
ENACT THE STANDARDS OF PUBLIC LIFE YOU LOW LIVES! Wait what am I saying, if they did, all of them would be in prison.
200 million is frivolous cruise berths is nothing compared to what we would have lost had the alternatives been given power. I’ll take it.
Rubbish ! no one can stop any one from following their own mind , those petition people are scared of failure because they know they are run out of time and they don’t have the votes they need, bottom line.
If the Government was so assured that this is the right thing and the people want it then why are they spending our money to try and suppress the petitions and if the petitions are doomed to fail because the people want the port then lets have the referendum and prove it once and for all. If the referendum comes and the port is voted in then that is that, the port has no resistance afterwards. The only people sacred of failure is the CIG, they are afraid the people will know the truth of this deal before it is done.
I say have the referendum and if the port is voted in then so be it but if it is not then it, Adlen, Moses, Mac, Austin and all those that switched to jump on the band wagon should all go to the wayside PERMANENTLY.
How is government trying to suppress the petition. By telling people the facts?
Do you know how many people have told me they support the piers but signed the petition thinking it was to get more information. Now they realise signing the petition will stop the project dead in its tracks they wish they hadn’t signed.
We can have the referendum no problem, but if the vote comes out in support of the piers we can’t just pick up where we left off and carry on. The whole procurement process has to start again which is 3 years of work and countless millions of the people’s money down the drain.
I say go ahead and build the piers and stop wasting time and money with the back and forth. Its been 20 years. How much longer are we going to talk about this before getting it done.
@ 5:51 Facts? Stopping the project dead in it’s tracks? ROFLMAO!!!!! You poor misguided troll. If the project is paused for a referendum and if voted in why would the procurement process have to start again? If the deal that shaky that it couldn’t survive the people democratic right to stop for a moment and vote about it?
Try go get a loan from any bank and tell me if it’s open ended or whether the offer is good for a given period of time.
Try get a quote for any kind of work from any kind of company and same thing applies. The quote will say offer only valid for 30 days.
Nothing with financial implications has an indefinite shelf life. And so when the financing offer for the DBFM expires the procurement process has to being again.
That’s 2 years down the drain to start again from scratch.
GOT IT NOW?
And here’s a question for you… how long do you expect this “pause” to hold a referendum will be? If you think it can happen in a couple months you’re the one that’s misguided my friend. Just verifying over 5,000 signatures will take longer than that!
@11:32 Once the referendum has the signatures the only reason it would take so long is if the POLITICIANS hold it up. Plus if the bid quotes were only good for 30 days then I think the existing bid quotes have long expired so that point is void. To get the loan from the bank, a bidder has to be awarded the contract then they go for the loan so again.. that point is void.
I think I get it more than you do. Stop making excuses, have the referendum and settle this once and for all.
@5:51 pm – You are a liar. How do people like you sleep at night? What exactly are the facts that the government has told us? Can you list them? The petition is NOT intended stop the project. The petition calls for a referendum that will allow voters to hear all of the facts and to have their say in whether or not the cruise pier project should proceed. The petition is in support of the democratic process.
You on the other hand are the problem. Spreading disinformation and lies to confuse people. You are exactly the problem here and in the US and in Brazil and in the UK. You are the problem every place on Earth. You don’t want the people to have a say in anything. You want to control people with your lies so that you can have YOUR way.
what has me confuse, the people that starts a conversation by saying
“well you know I am not against the port” and then goes on to name a
thousand reasons why their should not be a port !
you all claim you want a say but the only say you want is a say that say no dock!
Saying “I am not against a port” but I would like to see a port not built by CHEC, where acres of reef doesn’t have to be destroyed and the souls of our children won’t have to be sold to afford it.
that is a perfectly fine statement to make. It shows that I am for progress but not at too high a price. I understand that wanting something and not having to fuck something or someone over for it is a way of thinking you don’t understand and I pity you.
after we tear down Dart tunnel we will sea about the dock!
and remember the Great wall of China is still standing!
Huh?!?!
@8:41. The petition might not be intended to stop the piers but that will be the unintended consequence.
NO one has said voters cant have all of the facts. But you have to wait till the bids are in to get the details. You seem to want to jump the gun and have all the information before the process is complete, yet at the same time you also want the process to follow best practice.
If government could tell you exactly what was in the bids before they were received that’s when you should be worried. Let the process run its course. What’s your hurry?
If it is the will of the people to have or not have the port then it is the will of the people and a referendum will show that. You are right, no one said the voters can’t have the facts but when asked for them the CIG refuses to give them.
“If government could tell you exactly what was in the bids before they were received that’s when you should be worried.”
That was the most asinine statement I have heard today. Think of that statement next time your car breaks down and you send someone in with it to the garage to get it fixed and they come back with a bill for work you had no clue was needed.
On the other hand, we all wait until the bids are in, a preferred bid selected and at that stage, after all of the facts are known (if you seriously believe this will happen), Government is going to listen if there is a strong feeling that this is not the direction people feel the country should be taking? Let’s not kid ourselves that this is a realistic scenario.
next election we will vote in the population
then we will have all the says!
@11:41 am – you’re right, no one has SAID the public can’t have the facts. But no one has SHOWN the public the facts either.
The referendum will not hold up the bidding process, so what’s YOUR hurry?
Funny you should mention jumping the gun since thats exactly what CIG are doing!!
I signed the referendum because I want more transparency. I’m undecided as to the port. However, I don’t believe that if the people voted NO at the end of the day, it would not make a difference. Remember there were not enough numbers to support one man, one vote on that referendum – but they went ahead and changed that anyhow. This government, like all the ones before it does exactly what they please and don’t give 2 cents what the people think or want.
If the Standard for Public Life act was enacted that wouldn’t happen but our moral saviors in power don’t want to be leashed.
Anonymous 1 : 44pm , where are your ethics , dumped in the first word of your comment . I think that it is ethically wrong for the Unity government to had used Taxpayers money to work against them the Voters/Taxpayers .
The Cayman Islands Constitution Order 2009
People-initiated referendums
70.—(1) Without prejudice to section 69, a law enacted by the Legislature shall make provision to hold a referendum amongst persons registered as electors in accordance with section 90 on a matter or matters of national importance that do not contravene any part of the Bill of Rights or
any other part of this Constitution.
(2) Before a referendum under this section may be held—
(a) there shall be presented to the Cabinet a petition signed by not less than 25 per cent of persons registered as electors in accordance with section 90;
(b) the Cabinet shall settle the wording of a referendum question or questions within a reasonable time period as prescribed by law; and
(c) the Cabinet shall make a determination on the date the referendum shall be held in a manner prescribed by law.
(3) Subject to this Constitution, a referendum under this section shall be binding on the Government and the Legislature if assented to by more than 50 per cent of persons registered as electors in accordance with section 90.
.
.
#Petition #Referendum #Cayman #Constitution
Modern day communism. How can two gay people have their day in court to discuss the right to a specific life style yet, we have no right to vote on an important issue that sink this island into debt and damage the envorinment forever? Seems a bit unfair!
Somebody sounds scared, and it’s not ‘those petition people’
CNS an excellent article, I hope the Premier reads it.
It won’t make any difference if he does read it – his mind is totally CLOSED. Boy, am I sorry I voted for this jerk!!
Let’s hope the governor reads it.
… and the FCO
At Say it: Are you sure he can read?
Sec. 70 of the Cayman Islands Constitution 2009 clearly sets out the constitutional rights and the process for a People-Initiated Referendum on issues of national importance.
However, the 13 elected MLAs who make up the Government of National Unity, who are sworn to defend the Constitution and the rights of its citizens, are prepared to use tax paying public funds to fight against its citizens from exercising those rights.
Where are the checks and balances in the governance structure that are represented by the Ombudsman’s Office, The Auditor General’s Office, The Elections Office, The Attorney General’s Office and The Governor’s Office?
What exactly is the elected government afraid of that causes them to attempt to shut out the people from exercising fundamental rights enshrined in the Constitution?
Use your voice, get informed and sign the petition to exercise your democratic rights. The power rests in the people. We all deserve to know all the facts and to have our questions answered by our government before any agreements are signed. The scaremongering tactics and PR campaign by the government to stop its citizens is unprecedented.
The lack of transparency and deliberate misrepresentation of facts by CIG to suit their narrative ONLY drives further questions:
1. How will Cayman accommodate 2.5-3m cruise passengers per year? Does Cayman have the infrastructure to accommodate such numbers and provide a positive experience?
2. Where will passengers be situated when public beach accesses and facilities are limited and already strained?
3. Why is this Government committed to Quantity over Quality passenger experiences?
This is in direct contrast to the National Tourism Management Plan 2018-2023 under Attractions and Events – #14
4. What is the estimated total cost for a turnkey CBF facility?
5. How will the CBF be paid for?
It is important to note that surrendering tendering fees will not be enough to finance the deal over a 25 year term as we were originally told by government. Also tendering Services will still be required in some capacity during days when 5-8 ships are in port.
Where will the additional funds come from to pay for the project if the claim that CIG will not be paying for the CBF and there will be no new borrowings?
6. Is there a number (costs) that is deemed too much by this government, given the law of diminishing returns?
The time has come for the people to have their say on such important matters and infrastructure projects such as the CBF (cruise berthing facility) which “will be the largest, most complex and expensive capital works project in Cayman’s history”.
The decisions made today will impact present and future generations. We cannot afford to get them wrong.
Don’t forget the ongoing lifetime dredging costs to guarantee depth, running, and Maint costs, insurance (if it’s even possible)…a long list of missing recurring expenses.
Mr moxam , I have been wondering this for some time . Why is our money being spent to tell us what we want and don’t want ? A smart gov is suppose to listen to the people . Dear lord help us ,,,oh land of soft fresh breezes ,I’m missing you .
Well said and to the point Mr. Moxam . I will also say, I think that the Premier and the Unity government has stepping out of bounds of the Constitution in section 70 of the Constitution . The government working against the wishes of PEOPLE . Sounds like something that can be expected in Cuba , but not Cayman Islands .
Then why would the unity government use Taxpayers money to counter the petition for the referendum ? That is not the Government protecting the rights of the people . That is useing the Taxpayers money to work against them the Taxpayers .
I think this should be something that the Auditor General and Mr. Miller should look very closely into .
Wouldn’t the fact that the government is actively trying to suppress the wishes of the people in this instance in this way be considered a breach of trust and grounds for removal?
Government is using tax payers money to educate the people about the piers project. If the anti port lobbyists get enough signatures to trigger a referendum, a wholescale public education campaign would need to be undertaken using public money so people can be informed and decide one way or the other.
The anti port lobbyists are telling their side, government is telling their side. So how is that working against the will of the people?
Isn’t this what the anti-port lobbyists are supposedly asking for – more information?
Be careful what you wish for – you might get it.
Another mindless sheeple falling for the wolves in CIG clothing.
Great comments, Mr. Moxam! You tell it like it is! Our poor leadership is failing us more and more every day. It makes me wonder, “Are these representatives really serving to make things better for the Cayman people or are they trying to enrich themselves!!!!”
Great points Johan. These are basic questions that govt refuse to answer we should all be very afraid how it is being done
Thank you Mr. Moxam many caymanians are standing with you and the group who have signed the petition.
Johann , where are checks and balances from the Attorney General and all the others , in the same bed .
If and when the referendum hits it’s mark and the vote is cast, if the vote is no, this deal should be struck forever down and a vote of no confidence should be brought forward against Moses, Alden and Mac.
I call for a vote of no confidence to be brought to the MLA or an immediate General Election and I call for a policy of 1 and done and immediate bar of anyone who has served. Once you have been elected and then left your post for whatever reason you can no longer be considered for re-election again period. We have no professional politicians, all we have are bunch of business men and women who politic on the side. The CIG has been a laughing stock and has made the Cayman Islands one along with it, it is filled with greed and corruption and it is time we the people took our government back from those who only care to line their pockets with OUR money and the pockets of their select friends, family and cronies.
I saw it’s time we get the wall ready and start lining people up against it.
What would be even more interesting is to find out who is funding the anti-cruise berthing campaign. It is obviously well funded. One of the administrators of Save Cayman mentioned that they receive most of their funds from Sunset House and Red Sail, which coincidentally are owned by the same people who own the tender company. Funny that a monopoly making millions can spend whatever they would like to save their gravy train and no one blinks an eye.
Kirkbots spreading more lies. I guess they wrote the pr campaign and talking points for the ppm too
Truth be told does it really matter who is funding it? It is private individuals using their money to try and push for the use of a democratic right guaranteed to us by our constitution while the government is using OUR money to push the referendum down and DENYING us our right to a vote. At this point? Who is funding what is irrelevant.
How exactly is government denying you your right to vote? You haven’t got enough signatures to trigger the referendum. That’s not governments fault.
The government is engaged in a campaign to tell people falsely that voting for a referendum will stop the port. They are telling people NOT to exercise their democratic right when if the referendum was held and the people voted yes then it would be a done deal. They know people don’t want it and don’t want to chance being told so. The petition will get the signatures it needs, give it time.
How about section 117 which was to establish a committee to oversee the personal disclosures and conflict checks for all senior public servants? That committee has a long list of alumni, attending professional conferences, and traveling the world, yet has had nothing to do since inception! Almost a decade after the Constitution 2009, the Standards in Public Life Law, which would criminalize current free-for-all, still has not been enacted!
If it were then we would be needing a general election to replace the MLAs going to jail, there would be a ton of board openings all around and a lot of high level civil services jobs would open.
Mr. Moxam if I may. All that you have said and will say will not sway the Government are you all blind can’t you see. The only thing that politicians understand is when the people from all walks of life stand in front of them in a peaceful march of course and demand their rights. There are many who have signed and there are many more that would sign if there is a strong public showing . Have people come out and sign the petition in public . If you the organizers can’t get your people to stand up and stand out then your cause is for naught . A mere signature does not decree or show strength but people en masse do. Stop dittering and March ya people to the Assembly or CIG Admin building petition or no petition. You want to lead then lead not just vocally but with the strength and backing of ya people. Are you really ready to do this.
Are you saying private citizens should do what paid MLA’s are not doing? What would be the point of having paid MLA’s or the elected Opposition?
Josh , I have to agree with you this time . That’s the only way those arrogant politician will see the people on the LA steps PEACEFULLY .
Here’s a couple of questions for you Johann,
1. How is government preventing its citizens from exercising their rights? How exactly has the elected government attempted to shut out the people from exercising their constitutional rights?
Has government told the people they cannot have a referendum? NO!
Has Government has said it would not accept the petition? NO!
Have you gotten enough signatures to trigger a referendum NO!
The Constitution clearly says what is needed to trigger a referendum. If and when you collect enough signatures the process will run its due course. Until then how can you justifiably accuse government of stopping people from exercising their rights?
2. You talk about scaremongering tactics by government. You say you want more information and you deserve to know all the facts before any agreements are signed.
How many times does government have to say that the information you keep asking for WILL be made public WHEN it becomes available?
How is government supposed to tell you what will be in the final bids when the final bids haven’t been received yet? If they could I bet you’d be first in line calling foul!
How many times does government have to say the EIA will be updated; there will be more public consultation; the DoE will still be part of the process; but that stage hasn’t been reached yet?
3. Just because you don’t happen to like the answers doesn’t mean there is no transparency and government is hiding stuff. Why cant you have a little patience? cruise berthing has been talked about for 15 years. Why can’t you wait a few more months to have more information available? What’s the rush Johann? Jeez!
4. The plans for accommodating 2.3 (not 2.5-3m) cruise passengers per year are part of GT revitalization. This is not news. we were told this at the public meeting in June 2015 that you love to talk about. It is unrealistic to expect every single detail of the GT Revitalisation plan to be ready and sitting on a shelf waiting. The 2 projects have to move together so how can you expect to have all the answers up front on just one? last week on the radio they said the nitty-gritty details are being worked on now because this is the stage where it makes sense.
When building a house do you buy all the furniture first or do you wait till you get to that stage knowing that a) you have space to accommodate all of the furniture you need and b) getting them later doesn’t affect the building of the house and actually
makes more sense.
5. You keep asking if Cayman has the infrastructure to accommodate 2.3m and provide a positive experience?
Government says we do, the attractions say we do and the small businesses say we do. So why should anyone believe your personal opinion when the people that actually work with cruise on a daily basis say different based on their factual experience?
6. I guess you don’t like the answer to that one either cos its been said repeatedly that other beaches are being developed with all kinds of amenities to offer a fantastic experience, maybe even better than what is there now. Calico Jack is moving and others are too so you really don’t have to worry about where people will go. With other beaches in the mix there will be more space for people to choose where to go and less need for congestion in one space.
7. Who other than you has said anything about government being committed to quantity over quality? Government has said over and over that cruise AND stayover are important. One is not more important than the other and both need to have the right infrastructure in place for them to grow. Airport is being expanded to handle more growth. So why cant berthing be added to accommodate growth in cruise?
8. What is the estimated total cost for a turnkey CBF facility?
There you go again! why can’t you wait till the bids come back so government can tell you? do you really, really need to know right now, TODAY Johann?
9. How will the CBF be paid for? See answer above.
And on that point who says that tendering fees will not be enough to finance the deal over a 25 year term? Until and unless government is PROVEN to be lying, I for one will wait and see what the story is when the bids come back and we can all see what’s what.
10. Finally something I can agree with you on. “The CBF (cruise berthing facility) will be the largest, most complex and expensive capital works project in Cayman’s history”. I agree with you there and I also agree that the decisions made today will impact present and future generations.
So no, we cannot afford to get them wrong. But instead of rushing to judgement and making all kinds of accusations day in and day out, why not wait for the process to finish so all the questions actually CAN be answered ?
Mr. Moxam did not hide behind anonymity perhaps you’ll be brave enough to do the same and encourage your clients in government to answer questions from the public.
Sorry you’re wrong! I am the original poster and I’m not an agency. I dont have clients in government or anywhere for that matter and I’m not paid by anyone for my opinion. But thanks for the compliment thinking I’m some high up agency.
A sign you’re losing the PR battle is when the advertising agency hired by the ppm has to troll CNS bloggers anonymously.
Total deflection and bull$hit from a paid consultant. Follow D money!
1. How is government preventing its citizens from exercising their rights? How exactly has the elected government attempted to shut out the people from exercising their constitutional rights?
Has government told the people they cannot have a referendum? NO!
– not directly but the money they are spending to push one down is tantamount to a YES.
Has Government has said it would not accept the petition? NO! – Not yet
Have you gotten enough signatures to trigger a referendum NO! – Getting there
The Constitution clearly says what is needed to trigger a referendum. If and when you collect enough signatures the process will run its due course. Until then how can you justifiably accuse government of stopping people from exercising their rights?
– Have you listened to the radio or looked at the facebook page they made?
2. You talk about scaremongering tactics by government. You say you want more information and you deserve to know all the facts before any agreements are signed.
How many times does government have to say that the information you keep asking for WILL be made public WHEN it becomes available? – By then it will be too late to realistically make an informed decision because the deal would have been finalized.
How is government supposed to tell you what will be in the final bids when the final bids haven’t been received yet? If they could I bet you’d be first in line calling foul!
– Seriously? There are supposedly 3 bidders, how hard is it to disseminate information like expected projected costs, etc.
How many times does government have to say the EIA will be updated; there will be more public consultation; the DoE will still be part of the process; but that stage hasn’t been reached yet?
– The EIA is LONG over due to be updated, from when the design was changed that process should have been started.
3. Just because you don’t happen to like the answers doesn’t mean there is no transparency and government is hiding stuff. Why cant you have a little patience? cruise berthing has been talked about for 15 years. Why can’t you wait a few more months to have more information available? What’s the rush Johann? Jeez!
– Answers? Transparency? How did you use those two words in the same sentence that way. There have been 0 answers and 0 transparency. For 15 years they’ve been spouting this project and in 15 years we still not diddly about it.
4. The plans for accommodating 2.3 (not 2.5-3m) cruise passengers per year are part of GT revitalization. This is not news. we were told this at the public meeting in June 2015 that you love to talk about. It is unrealistic to expect every single detail of the GT Revitalisation plan to be ready and sitting on a shelf waiting. The 2 projects have to move together so how can you expect to have all the answers up front on just one? last week on the radio they said the nitty-gritty details are being worked on now because this is the stage where it makes sense.
– To accommodate the additional tourist would mean adding more space to GT, exactly how is that even possible? Oh yeah, more concrete in the ocean.
When building a house do you buy all the furniture first or do you wait till you get to that stage knowing that a) you have space to accommodate all of the furniture you need and b) getting them later doesn’t affect the building of the house and actually makes more sense.
– When you are building a house, during the process you should already have what you want at least picked out and would be able to describe it to your friends and family if asked. As far as we know, this house ain’t got no furniture.
5. You keep asking if Cayman has the infrastructure to accommodate 2.3m and provide a positive experience?
Government says we do, the attractions say we do and the small businesses say we do. So why should anyone believe your personal opinion when the people that actually work with cruise on a daily basis say different based on their factual experience?
– Have you taken a walk through town when there are 4 ships in? “Army intelligence” is an oxymoron.. so is “government facts.” The small business in town? Which ones are they? Last time I saw, majority of the “small businesses” in town were owned by 1 of 3 groups of people.
6. I guess you don’t like the answer to that one either cos its been said repeatedly that other beaches are being developed with all kinds of amenities to offer a fantastic experience, maybe even better than what is there now. Calico Jack is moving and others are too so you really don’t have to worry about where people will go. With other beaches in the mix there will be more space for people to choose where to go and less need for congestion in one space.
– Yes the new proposed beaches to be developed by a single company who will whisk the tourists straight from the docks, out of GT, away from “small businesses” to stop, sit, eat and shop at his beach, his stores, his restaurants. Oh yes, that will make everyone’s lives so much better.
7. Who other than you has said anything about government being committed to quantity over quality? Government has said over and over that cruise AND stayover are important. One is not more important than the other and both need to have the right infrastructure in place for them to grow. Airport is being expanded to handle more growth. So why cant berthing be added to accommodate growth in cruise?
– did you write that with a straight face? The Airport isn’t destroying acres of what people come here to see. The Airport didn’t cost $200M+. We still own and control the airport instead of handing it over to a FOREIGN COUNTRY’S FRONT CO. for 25 plus years. We are still making money from the airport instead of giving all of it’s revenue to same said company.
8. What is the estimated total cost for a turnkey CBF facility?
There you go again! why can’t you wait till the bids come back so government can tell you? do you really, really need to know right now, TODAY Johann?
– $200 – 300M at minimum. How are you okay with that much of our money being spent without more information. YES we really really need to know, we should have been told a long time ago. It’s called TRANSPARENCY!
9. How will the CBF be paid for? See answer above.
And on that point who says that tendering fees will not be enough to finance the deal over a 25 year term? Until and unless government is PROVEN to be lying, I for one will wait and see what the story is when the bids come back and we can all see what’s what.
– We can’t prove them lying is they don’t share information. By the time the bids come back it will be too late.
10. Finally something I can agree with you on. “The CBF (cruise berthing facility) will be the largest, most complex and expensive capital works project in Cayman’s history”. I agree with you there and I also agree that the decisions made today will impact present and future generations.
– All the more reason we need more information and for our CIG to be more transparent.
Johann don’t forget it was the decisions of past Governments why we have this great
Cayman that you brags about and why we are living
High on the hog, the biggest problem we have is what will we find to complain about
the Government tomorrow.
I hope you will be man enough to run for election next time, then every thing will be fine. (or life on the talk shows are less a challenge)
That’s a scary view of local politics. Based on your comment an individual only truly cares for the country if they run for election?
if you are elected you will have more power to care!
@10:16 Past governments weren’t throwing around $200 millions dollars and keeping secret on details that will have the largest impact on this island it has ever seen. And it was the Governments of the past who was stopped by the FCO for trying to do the exact same project they are trying to do now.
Enact the Standards of Public Life law and if the dock is built? Investigate everyone of the MLA’s who were on board and see who got paid off and how much.
you people are crying about 200 million 200 million
these days, that’s pocket change!
Ok Dart
They cant even build a school on budget or on time. How can anyone believe this project wont be a complete disaster?
and if tomorrow don’t come that would be a bigger disaster!
Let’s also bear in mind that most of the ships do not stay in the Caribbean over the summer so any increase in numbers will, by the nature of the business, be loaded mainly into busy season, when we also receive the most hotel guests and our beach facilities and downtown facilities are stretched. What does this mean? Cruise ship guests taken to other areas. Who owns those other areas? Who profits most from this?
9:54 are you aware that thinking in negative therms are infinite?
How can the current elected members for the Progressive’s party say that they had a majority, when the break down is as follows: Progressives – 7, United Democratic party – 3, Independents – 9. Clearly, the independents were the majority. How many of them actually campaigned for a port? What is wrong with putting such an important decision to the voting public? If the majority of the voters are in favor of the port, then we will have to live with that decision. But please don’t force something on us especially if the majority do not want it. What we have to be careful of, what will the terms and conditions of this contract consist of? Please people, be very careful of what we are about to do. This is a major project that will have to be financed for a very long time. I am not against a dock, but please let us do it right!!!!!!
sunrise, yes you had 9 scattered independents
was that what you wanted for Government !
Would much rather 9 scattered independents than a collection of scheming old men who need to retire.
ha ha ha!???? yet the very same caymaniabs likely to vite the same persons in next time…as they all do….ahoy matie’s time to set uyur sails for new territory!????
“Government is also using misleading figures about the number of tourism jobs that it claims will be lost if the project does not go ahead. Many of the 4,000 workers who government says depend on tourism are on work permits, and many of them also service the growing and far more lucrative overnight business.”
I would say 90 – 95% of these work permit jobs are for the hotels and those jobs are not under a threat if the port is not built. We need to scrap this stupidity of destroying acres of living reef and putting the islands into indentured debt with the loss of control of the port for 25 years and start focusing on the stay over tourists and find ways in to crease that number.
George Town cannot handle the CIG’s vision of growth in cruise tourists, it can just handle the tourists now unless they plan to turn the terminal into, like so many others here in the Caribbean, enclosed little shopping towns that will eliminate access to many of the smaller shops.
If that ever happened I don’t think I need to say which family will control the majority of the over priced jewelry and crap being sold in it. Right Moses?
This dock is probably going to be the biggest mistake Cayman will ever make (and that’s saying something considering the daily bad decisions this government makes). This port will cause massive environmental damage as well as cost the people at least $300 million (no plan or figures that show we will ever make the money back).
I’m just sickened, disheartened and angry that Alden could even say he has a mandate to build this port. I’m whole heartedly against this port but I still feel this should go up for a vote. If the Caymanian people really want this port, they will voice their support for it in a referendum. I will still think it’s a terrible and stupid idea, but at least the people made the choice and not Kirkconnel and Alden.
11:01 at the least you are man or woman enough to say ” I am whole heartedly against the port”and not beating the bush like others.
Instead of enacting the Standards in Public Life Law, this regime has prioritized using LA time to vote for corrosion-resistant medals, and will be spending time ramming through a bill to give Juju absolute sole discretion to re-name streets. You can’t make this stuff up.
There was an election, the dock was on the ballot and won. I support the Dock.
The refferendum is actually an attempt to UNDO the election agenda.
It just wasn’t on the ballot…
Ummm… I had the option to vote for one man or woman at the polls, a dock wasn’t one of the options! It’s a pity really, I might have gotten better representation out of a pile of concrete.
Anonymous 10:59 is a bald-faced liar.
It wasn’t on the ballot and the PPM didn’t even win a majority, they have no mandate, this is a farce
It wasn’t on the ballot and you Sir are a troll.
Johan, have you given any thought to organizing a march to the governor’s office ASAP. I think we should before they start to brainwash him. Anyone Interested?
5:24 don’t try that, when you look behind it will only be your shadow you see that is scary
Correct sir, CHEC & Decco said get it thru and the puppets will do as they are instructed. This is not about what the people want but what the power wants and no one will change the course of our elected officials.
This is one of the many lies being repeated. While the “dock” may have been “on the ballot” somehow in your opinion/experience (though I don’t recall seeing any mention of it in the press in general by candidates prior to the 2017 election), I can assure you that our household (4 votes) would not have been in favour of any candidate campaigning for this pier, and it was a narrow electoral victory in our voting district. To repeat, had we had any indication our (winning) candidate was going to participate in forcing this project on the Country, we would have voted differently, and nor did I see anything in the broader press suggesting the (largest minority winning) party had “the dock on the ballot”. So this oft-repeated point is doubly (and simply) wrong, from my perspective.