CAL grounds Max 8 after Ethiopian crash
Cayman Airways 737 Max 8 jet
(CNS): In the wake of a second tragic, fatal crash of a Boeing 737 Max 8 aircraft, in less than five months, this time in Africa, Cayman Airways has grounded its two new planes. After an Ethiopian Airlines flight from Addis Ababa bound for Nairobi crashed minutes after takeoff on Sunday, killing all 157 people on board, airlines around the world using Boeing’s Max 8 aircraft began suspending them from service. CAL President and CEO Fabian Whorms said that while the cause of the crash was so far unknown, passenger and crew safety was the first priority for the national flag carrier.
“While the cause of this sad loss is undetermined at this time, we stand by our commitment to putting the safety of our passengers and crew first by maintaining complete and undoubtable safe operations, and as such, we have taken the decision to suspend operations of both our new Boeing 737 Max 8 aircraft, effective from Monday March 11, 2019, until more information is received,” he stated as he offered condolences to the loved ones killed yesterday.
Whorms said Cayman Airways is currently working in coordination with both the Boeing Corporation and the Civil Aviation Authority of the Cayman Islands (CAACI) to monitor the investigation into Ethiopian Airlines Flight 302.
He offered assurances to customers that the airline will take “all prudent and necessary actions required for the safe operation of the Max 8’s” before they are returned to service. In the meantime, some “relatively minor, but necessary schedule and capacity changes will be needed over the next few days” in order to manage the shortage of planes that pulling the aircraft has caused.
“We appreciate the understanding and support of our customers as we implement these changes, and apologise in advance for any inconveniences that may be caused,” Whorms said.
CAL received its second Max 8 just a few days ago but safety issues were raised about the aircraft after the Lion Air disaster in Indonesia last October, when the plane went down into the Java Sea less than 15 minutes after take-off, killing the 189 people on board. Boeing and the United States Federal Aviation Administration issued alerts and directives to emphasise the need for flight crews to carry out a set of prescribed procedures contained within the 737 Max operating manuals.
At the time Cayman Airways said it had already incorporated the procedural and training elements necessary to comply with the prescribed Boeing and FAA instructions and said it remained confident in the aircraft.
While no link in the cause of the two crashes has yet been made, both airlines involved were said by experts to be well run with good safety records. Ethiopian Airlines said Monday that the cockpit voice recorder and the digital flight data recorder had both been recovered from the wreckage, which will help determine the cause of the crash shortly.
I think we’ll find that any pilots, regardless of 737-type hours flown, that failed to take Boeing’s “optional” MCAS training in these months post-Lion Air will be banned from the cockpits of MAX-8’s.
Regardless of the rumours, and yet to be learned factors, that contributed to this particular deadly tragedy, can CAL please make a definitive proactive statement on whether all of our MAX-qualified pilots opted to receive the “optional” post-Lion Air MCAS Training offered by Boeing?
Incredibly, this training supplemental was not made mandatory and pilot associations as recently as January, had complained about widespread ongoing ignorance about stick shaker and MCAS resolution protocol among so-called MAX-qualified pilots.
MAX pilots are 737 pilots that are not required to undergo any new rating training, just a differences tutorial, and MCAS simulators don’t yet exist (Southwest have one opening next month). Fault complexity-related crew confusion, if that’s what this proves to be, is an avoidable tragedy waiting for a place to happen, even among very experienced pilots with previously perfect flight records. It is terrifying to learn that this was not mandatory training!
https://www.aerosociety.com/news/lion-air-lessons/
Excellent point
The UK has just banned them in their airspace and so that includes Cayman.
Not surprised that the US under Transportation Secretary Elaine Chao, Senate Speaker Mitch McConnell’s wife, has but Boeing’s reputation and $$’s over safety.
Interesting that CIAA haven’t banned everyone else’s from our “airspace” in lockstep with CAL. Hosting someone else’s crash isn’t any more appealing.
The CIAA cannot apply this ban, but the CAACI can.
The question is not Cayman Airways banning them but what is the country doing. Do we have to wait for the UK to ban them from our skies as several other countries have done.
I mean our main hospital us on the freaking flight path.they certainly should only be allowed to take off in the direction of the sound.
2 hospitals and our fuel tanks in the direct flight path!! Ban them!!
It is a bold and commendable decision to remove them from service, but it will be a bolder one to put them back into service if the investigation is inconclusive. May be prudent and a good time to re-negotiate the lease for different equipment.
My layman understanding:
The 737 model was approved in the 60s, I believe. So the premise for safety is long established and unquestionable. Hands down.
Over the years, Boeing has made different upgrades and the Max8 is but one of them.
Earlier today, they issued a statement to the effect that they are now making an additional upgrade aka change to “an already safe model”. Interesting words in my mind. Notwithstanding the fact of a safe 737 model.
The NTSB/Aviation administration, in America’s case, approve models. They then approve upgrades to models in the same classifications. In the case of the Max8 it would have received its approval in consideration because it was submitted as a 737 model.
We all have read of the changes or upgrades made that is called the max 8. The AOA – (An automated correction system to prevent stalling) is one of the biggest “upgrades” to this 737 and we understand it was to facilitate the changes made to the engine size and positioning on the wings.
Question is: were these changes substantial enough that they should not have been listed as a 737?. I ask this because, I read that in the manuals of the 737 Max8 upgrade, this crucial system was not listed feature as an upgrade. Maybe as in so many cases cost savings from an approval process consideration play into these decisions. To our detriment of course, in my mind anyway.
I suspect it’s the companies – Boeing…Airbus business decision when submitting for approvals of new launches. I’m sure a number of variables play into that decision, both for company and the approval body based on that submission. The question in my mind would be: how vigorous is that scrutiny by the approval body based on the submitted changes to a model so as to recommend a different model classification? I deduce that model changes would have required many things, including extensive training etc. – costly business decision especially for purchasers both in man hours of training and certification etc etc.
That would have been necessary had it been listed as a new model.
Of course they will not admit that. There are hundreds in the field. Hundreds of orders and well they would be accepting culpability in the risk and outcome of that risk decision of those crashes, imho.
They got approval under the 737 model and perhaps if they had highlighted the AOA system in the manual it would have flagged the approval process for a model change. I wonder who will accept responsibility? Assuming the cause of the accidents are identical in findings.
I say kudos to our KX for making a difficult decision through the maze of disinformation and uncertainty.
Hey, you could get killed here any day in the week getting on the road with the idiots we have around here. Today being the latest example as the ass coming from north to town decided to overtake and squeeze between two cars ,then luckily got clipped and flipped onto its roof. Sweet karma.
Nice call CAL. Smarter than most. Ground m for now and let’s see what happens. You were pro active in your response and in the end will come out ahead.
New form of terrorism, insider employee at boeing planting a software bug in all these planes. Just a cynical suggestion, the world has gone made. Good call CAL.
For those who feel CAL should have put its head down and kept quiet— you are wrong. In terms of public relations that is the worst strategy.
That has been one of our biggest problems. We need to get past this attitude that is still evident across govt.
It never did work, but it in today’s world of fast moving information, it spells disaster. We just look stupid when we fail to communicate and it breads distrust.
And all we do is trigger more rumours. Nature abhors a vacuum.
Proud of CAL — make your decision in a timely way and stand by it. And say nothing more until the situation changes.
Whether we agree with the decision or not, that was good PR at work. Everyone knows where we stand, and we squelch the runours.
Good job.
Stop leasing 737 max 8 Fabian and CaL Board of Directors. We do not need so much plane. Lease the A220-300 formerly the CS300. It is the same size as the 737-300 and even more fuel effecient than the max 8. The seats are 1 to 2 inches wider and it is a modern airplane
The 737 was designed in the late 60s. The A220-300 is a modern airplane that is safer, more fuel effecient, more comfortable, has a comparable range of over 3500 miles and does not need 8000 feet of run way with MTOW. It needs less than 6500 feet with MTOW. The country will save 20 million on run way extension and tons on leasing. Cayman Airways will even save on pilot salaries since pilots get paid based on size of airplane.
I guess the pilots will protest this and it will not happen.
Vindication for CAL:
Countries and airlines that have grounded their MAX 8s:
In addition to CAL, China and Ethiopia:
– Australia
– Indonesia
– Singapore
– Brazil’s GOL Airlines
– Aero Mexico
– South Africa’s Comair
– South Korea’s Eaststar Jet
– Royal Air Maroc
– India’s Jet Airways
Meanwhile, the US FAA has issued a “continued airworthiness notification” indicating that the plane remains in their view safe to fly. The agency said that the “investigation has just begun” and have not been “provided any data or information to draw conclusions or take any action.”
The FAA had said, however, that it would mandate “design changes” to the aircraft to be done by next month in response to last month’s Lions Air crash.
The changes will include updates to the computer system and the flight crew manual.
Experts interpret the FAA’s “continued airworthiness” notice to mean that the FAA is leaving the door open to possible change of that notice.
Similar experts continue to express concern about allowing the MAX 8 to continue to fly, but US airlines are said to have robust training that may overcome the issues for the time being.
However, experts also recognize Ethiopian Air as the pride of Africa and said that Ethiopia had become the training hub for Africa.
Meanwhile, this morning, reporters visiting the debris-strewn crater created by the crash in Addis Abba said that from all appearances it seems as if the crash was a high energy nose first dive reminiscent of Lion Air’s crash.
Add the U.K. to the list. In 7:28 am.
So proud of CAL for leading the field in making the right decision. They demonstrate that safety is first considetation at CAL and builds trust.
Hey, I don’t want to fly on a plane that has a small chance of committing suicide. The idea of the plane’s faulty instrumentation pointing it straight at the ground and me dying in a fireball along with everyone else is terrifying, and it’s already happened twice. Those odds are too high.
CAL made a good decision but of course they cant please everyone… stop complaining.
Those funding the ongoing boondoggle that is CAL have every right to voice their opinion, even if you don’t like it. It belongs to everyone through direct public subsidy.
@CNS
The real question still needs to be asked. What is going to happen to the Denver flight? There is no other aircraft in the KX fleet that can do this trip non-stop. All other aircraft will require a fuel-stop, which would be a relatively horrible experience for the Denver passengers. Are they going to cancel the route in the interim? Or will they be using an older aircraft with a fuel stop? The beauty of the Max8 (range) is also the achilles for KX in this scenario. Although very smart decision to ground them until further information is gathered. Safety first.
Forgot about Denver and your inconvenience argument. We’re talking about safety and averting a possible disaster. Airline logistics will work it out trust me.
Of course it will be a fuel stop. Either in IAH/DFW or somewhere closer such as Tampa.
Nonse. Denver is 1950 miles away. 737 300 has a range of 2250 miles.
What is the weather/re-route reserve range?
Hah not AVguy. Not a chance my friend. You need to factor in a ton of other factors than just “range in miles” including the ability to re-route around weather, descend towards Cayman, and then re-route to Jamaica if the airport in Cayman had a problem (let’s just say the prior aircraft blew a tire on the runway)
The 737-300 will NEVER fly direct from Cayman to Denver, or Denver to Cayman.
Boeing Corporation is an AMERICAN corporation. Just proves that just because its from the U.S. or U.K. doesn’t ensure mechanical safety.
What’s the UK got to do with this?.
What the reviews of the Max 8 — other than the issue with the flying of the plane—the cabin space is rated as God awful, especially the size of the toilet. The reviews say that it is impossible to turn around in the toilets — and that a passenger could not get out on the inaugural flight of AA.
I don’t believe we should have bought these planes — but I am not sure if anything can be done now. We may be stuck with them.
Anyway, I think it was a good call to ground them.
Cayman hasn’t “bought them’ as such , the planes are leased from an aviation leasing company that manages the financing package on the planes. All the fanfare and local gushing over acquiring two new planes might give a person the impression that KX ‘Owns’ these two aircraft , but I doubt that’s the case.
At 113.8m a pop, CAL sure as hell don’t own these.
Reviews from overweight Americans whiners no doubt. Tell them to go buy two seats on southwest instead.
5:33 pm: actually, no. It was really the view of a pilot:
https://travelingformiles.com/american-airlines-737-max-8-routes/
I take no pleasure in this, as I love CAL. It is the national airline and I want to support it.
But the toilets sound positively claustrophobic.
Since we have only leased them, we may have some tough decisions ahead—sooner or later.
Cayman Airways interior configuration on the new planes is very spacious. The airlines make a choice about how many people to cram in and thankfully the choice made by the National Carrier was to maintain a good level of comfort.
Expat/Airmiles Andy, What do you expect when so many civil servants and CAL employees fly on them.(free of charge of course).
This is a huge set back for our national airline. I hope it all works out positively in due cocurse. I have always heard that Cayman airways pilots and management always put safety first. Thank you guys. This little island could not handle it if you continued to fly and such tragedy happen. We can sort this out with booing but we could never undo a major incident. GOd bless you all.
No,a huge setback would be a tragic crash when we had the opportunity to ground which the airline rightfully exercised. Got your priorities all twisted it seems.
Anyone remember the DC-10 engine separation crashes? The aircraft was grounded as unsafe but it turned out the real problem was maintenance crews cutting corners during engine changes.
Too soon to conclude that the aircraft was at fault. Reports coming online are suggesting the Ethiopian crash involved a fire at the rear of the aircraft so let’s not rule out sabotage here.
Nope, the DC10 engine change procedure was an approved alternative procedure, turned out to be a fatal one too. It is wrong to say they were ‘cutting corners’. They were following a flawed procedure.
As for the fire, this was an eye witness report and no amount of speculation on that is of any value until such a time the investigation can verify all the information available, there are hundreds of reasons why a fire may have started.
One eye witness report contradicted by another eye witness report, and the only hard data from the transponder being eerily similar to the Lion Air incident. As poster suggests maybe we should wait for the air accident report, but given its 2 very similyingidents bothbin aircraft under a year old it is very alarming and we hope NTSA gets a report out ASAP.
Should never had been purchased in the first place.
Matter of fact ,the one that crashed yesterday is said to be the new one
They didn’t purchase them. They leased them. Quit complaining about stuff that you don’t actually know.
Here’s what I do know and that is Boeing or anyone else is yet to determine the cause of the other crash six months ago so why would we go ahead and get further in debt with a secound one..is that plain enough for you?bought,leased it does’nt realy matter does it?
I support the decision made by Cayman Airways.
Thank you Mr. Whorms. You made the right decision.
i know folks who work at ciaa…..they havent flown cal for years based on what they see behind the scenes…
That’s BS
I bet they’ll be flying CAL now knowing that AA and Southwest are still flying their crappy 8 max planes.
3.50pm So should Cayman Airways return these crappy planes which they coudn’t afford in the first place?.
Spiffy story. I also know a guy who knows a guy who works there; he said the guy said your guy is still mad about being fired.
Behind the scenes? Who needs to look behind the scenes when consistent delays are right in front of you. They don’t fly CAL not because of what goes on behind the scenes (and really, it’s just mismanagement, see: the Lufthansa report), but because they want to get where they’re going on time.
Think about it… Would you rather be delayed or dead? Let them take their time to get the planes right before takeoff.
Just imagine how one of these crashes would scar this community if it happened to a Cayman Airways jet. Never mind the reputation and finances and all that. It just can’t happen.
Although pulling from service was sensible, exploiting the media opportunity to broadcast to BBC (and world) that Cayman Airways flies these, was not tactically smart as a very small airline business. When you have new routes to service, and no spare planes, sometimes it’s better to quietly cope in the background as best you can, without the added spotlight. The planes could be sidelined for weeks or months…expect delays!
It’s public knowledge what airlines have taken delivery, grounded and still currently operate, really not that big an issue. Says the airline is operating on the far side of caution, really don’t see who out there would not be okay with that given the 100% casualty rate of the crashes so far. “Quietly cope in the background” is what you do when you’ve all but given up.
Obscure public record is not the same as common knowledge. There is a critical difference, especially when it comes to deciding to attach the carrier brand to a negative global headline. Broadcasting, “look at us – we also bought the defective planes that nobody will want to fly in” is not a strong flight-booking tactic, despite the prudence of following China in grounding our two planes. Cat’s out of the bag now, in any case.
welcome to 2019. the world new we were flying them from the time we got them.
Id rather know the truth myself
11:28 — we are now a global village — everything is an open book — remember the Internet?
Your wrong about that. What always causes the most outrage, the greatest drama, and the largest litigation is a cover-up. Often the cover-up itself is far worse than what is being concealed.
Mr. Whorms did exactly the right thing. CAL can not be perceived as “that airline” with questionable practices and protocols. CAL is too small; it cannot absorb any bad publicity, and it is too important to our tourism model to risk anything.
Most people who are inconvenienced by the grounding of the planes will still thank Mr. Whorms. I wonder what kind of person would say “go ahead, let ’em fly, we’ll take our chances!!” I know I don’t want to fly with that person.
I get what you’re saying about ‘quietly coping’, however this place is too small for that. It WOULD get out and it would be twisted into a conspiracy cover-up.
Kudos to Cayman Airways. So proud of our national airline. The right decision made straight away. All over the international news this morning. Well done!
Why be proud of them Sandra? They would not be in this position if Moses Kirkconnell and his cronies had listened to the people and not bought these damned planes. He was told from the beginning not to purchase them as there was problems. But NO he forges ahead and does as he wants with the full support of the spineless Alden and the others. Just like he will forge ahead with the port. God help us.
Pathetic attempt to play politics. No one contested the purchase of these planes until the first accident happening with lion air. All of Cayman was at the arrival ceremony of Cayman Airways 737-800 and the MAX 8 which all knew was part of a bigger plan that would eventually lead to all fleet being replaced with Boeing 737 MAX aircraft. Just like CEO whorms has stated,this fleet modernisation plan was announced two years in advance and nobody had any issues until the planes arrived. And now they’ve made the right decision to TEMPORARILY ground the aircraft and the hypocrites still bashing KX.
Sorry 2.38pm but CAL could not afford 4 of these new jets.The cost has been kept secret no dooubt because it’s exorbitant and the deficit will reach epic proportions this year. CAL is ony still in the air because the taxpayer has had to fork out tens of millions of dollars a year in subsidies, and you wonder why it gets bashed?.
They didn’t buy the planes! They are leased! Some people love to complain without knowing the facts.
7.02pm who said CAL bought the planes, it’s public knowledge that they were leased and it’s public knowledge the leasing costs were kept secret to avoid more adverse publicity for CAL.I bet you would complain if you knew the facts (of the lease).
I like the way Fabian thinks… cant be late all the time if they’re not flying at all!
Many airlines are continuing to run their Max 8’s even after the two crashes. Thank you to Cayman Airways for putting safety over profits until the cause of these crashes are understood and can be prevented.
Cayman Airways is freed of the shackles of worrying about profits, so it had an advantage over real airlines.
Sounds like ‘another reason to support CAL’ 🙂
1.07pm the truth is that every single taxpayer in the Cayman Islands without exception, supports CAL
CNS we need the lol button back
I was just thinking that! lolol
12:02 pm: need help with the egg all over your face now that “real” airlines have followed CAL in grounding their Max 8 fleets? Including the UK. Hello!
I applaud CAL. As for the inevitable delays due to the grounding of two of its fleet, I would rather be late and alive.
Everyday they don’t fly they ain’t losing money. win win.
really not sure that’s how it works with an airline.
Yes but we still have to bend over and pay the piper wether they fly or not. Sadly we are all benefactors to this lame duck they call Cayman Airways?
What is safe about traveling the speed of sound in a metal box suspended thousands of feet in the air?
Speed of sound? I want to know which airline you’re taking! Count me in!
Its safer than your metal box with 4 wheels you drive in every day.
Tell that to the passengers of the Ethopian flight @12:50.
They wouldn’t hear me.
10:41 Try flying at twice the speed of sound – I’ve done that and it’s a damn sight safer than being on any freeway in the USA.
Its not the Concorde we are dealing with , you know… they stopped flying years ago
Boyyy
Is that the best you can post ? Hardly worth the effort.
You must work fo CAL
This will cost our airline a lot of money and it’s passengers a lot of inconvenience, but Mr Whorms made the right decision.
It will cost our airline nothing. It will cost us a fortune in larger subsidy.
Consumer behaviour is very funny. Without it knowing the facts from the first boeing 737 Max 8 accident, cayman’s expert community was already calling for the planes to be sent back and no one was gonna fly on it. This second accident has only fueled the charlatans. Now, CAL made a decision to ground these planes and possibly saves lives in doing so until further notice, y’all talking about losing money and inconvenience. Money nor time can replace a life…..
Living is the leading cause of death,
I thought dying may have been the leading cause of death! 😉
It might be covered by insurance.
Unlikely it was his decision
Not fit for purpose. Send them back for a full refund and sue Boeing for any losses!
OK, so can you explain? And NO I do not work for CAL, I just hate ignorance being spewed.
Better safe than sorry.
I feel this is a good call, since we are surrounded by deep water not very far offshore.
9.56am Your logic escapes me, what has deep water got to do with it.
@Say it like it is: I’m pretty sure the black box sinking to the bottom of the trench would require specialized equipment to reach it. Think about it, how deep is the Cayman trench? As far as I am aware, black boxes don’t float after breaking up hitting the ocean.
After looking up some more information, it has come to my attention that in 2017, “Some” black boxes of the newer aircraft from Airbus are capable of floating, however I do not know if Boeing’s 737 Max 8’s black boxes are capable of floating.
4.37pm Your logic still escapes me, what has the Cayman Trench got to do with an aircraft flying from here to Denver?.
The depth of the water doesnt matter very much if the aircraft flies straight into the ocean at full throttle – the Lion Air crash was into relatively shallow water.
You are correct, while the depth of water doesn’t matter, at the “point of impact”, what does matter is the operation required for recovery of the black boxes. Suppose it sinks to a depth of 20,000+ ft, what then?
Good move KX. Brave but correct move. Nice to see unflinching leadership on the issue. Well done!
9.45am The leadership is unflinching because there’s no accountability, lose a lot more money and the coffers are simply topped up by the taxpayer.
Thank you Cayman Airways. This is the prudent and responsible decision.
Boeing made this decision for CAL.
So your thesis is Boeing made this decision for Cayman and the Chines but not for any other airline operating the aircraft?
dummy. Boeing has not made no statement to any airline to ground. if they did. American, Southwest, Air Canada would have grounded theirs ..
“The two American airlines with the most MAX 8s – Southwest and American airlines – issued statements to CNN saying they would continue to fly the MAX 8, saying they remain confident in the aircraft.” reported at 1:38 today 11 March
3.37pm They have to account to their shareholders unlike CAL.
Sounds like a Board Member.
Jumping the gun, following the Chinese. Cowardly decision.
Cayman Airways was the first airline to Ground the MAX followed by China. Although all of Chinas was out of the air while KX still operated KX106/107/ BUT KX was first.
#fakenews
As someone who was off island for a few days and returned last night by Cayman Airways, I prefer to be delayed rather than DEAD!!! Moreover, they announced the grounding of the Max 8 yesterday before the Chinese who did it today.
Idiot
But if you look at safety record/ accident history of some of airlines still standing by the MAX 8 and pledging to continue to fly it, you wouldn’t be surprised at their decision. Profits come first. Noticing a trend though with US based aircraft and aircraft parts manufacturers and the extremely slow pace if at all, as it relates to grounding and recall policies.
How do we recall experienced 737 pilots that opted not to take Boeing’s “optional” supplemental MCAS training in these months post Lion Air?
Do you have a type rating, are you an ATP? How do you training on such a critical system was “optional’?
Good decision! I listened to two well recognized aviation experts discussing the grounding on CNN this morning and they both agreed it was a wise decision—and the only decision that should be made at this time.