Minister defends changes for Health City doctors
(CNS): Changes to the Health Practitioners Law, apparently designed to help doctors and other professional healthcare workers at Health City Cayman Islands renew their licence to practice beyond the original six year cap, were brought in good faith and not to avoid government law suits, the health minister has said. Dwayne Seymour said they were to address anomalies with licence renewals and related issues that would smooth the registration process and lift the cap.
Speaking in the Legislative Assembly last week, Seymour said that his ministry had received representation about sorting out some anomalies between the health law and regulations that led to early expiry on some doctors’ licences. However, the justification for all the amendments was not detailed.
In the debate following the confusing presentation of the amending legislation, opposition members said the bill would create more problems surrounding what are known as institutional practitioners, those working at the East End hospital, where the qualification for a licence is not as stringent as other doctors working elsewhere.
Ezzard Miller (NS) questioned the minister about how many people were affected, what problem the bill was seeking to fix and who had caused the registration and licensing problems, as he urged him to withdraw the legislation.
He argued that the ‘institutional’ provision had been designed for Health City doctors only, with a cap, as they were not meant to be in Cayman beyond six years. But this law would allow them to stay much longer, which would enable them to go on to get permanent residence and then work at other healthcare facilities, undermining the original intention of the law to try and protect local doctors who need to reach much higher standards to get a licence.
Miller challenged the minister about the lack of support in the sector from stakeholders for these changes and said it illustrated the problems that the parallel system the institutional provision for registration has created. He also raised the question of pending lawsuits, after it was clear some Health City doctors had been practicing without licences because they had expired before their six years were up, though it was unclear how that had happened.
His concerns were echoed by Deputy Opposition Leader Alva Suckoo, who questioned why the cap was going to be lifted, saying that this defeated the entire purpose of having the separate systems designed to protect local doctors. Suckoo also warned of the dangers of passing legislation for specific individuals.
But Seymour defended the bill, saying people had great confidence in the Heath City doctors and that they had saved many lives. He said they should be allowed to stay and, like anyone else, go on to apply for PR if they qualified, though it did not mean they would necessarily achieve it.
Seymour said people had become attached to their doctors and Caymanians should be thankful for the HCCI doctors for coming here and doing the great work that they did.
See the debate on CIG TV below:
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Category: Health, Laws, Medical Health, Politics
See Government notice: http://www.gov.ky/portal/page/portal/cighome/pressroom/archive/200602/practicinginci
“Cayman allows the registration of health practitioners who are fully registered, or eligible for full registration, in Australia, Canada, Jamaica, New Zealand, South Africa, UK or US, or those who have met the Caribbean regional registration requirements. The applicant is responsible for providing the council with evidence of his registration or eligibility for full registration in any of the countries listed above.”
[Note: India is not in the list of eligible countries]
“This particular requirement does not exclude anyone from practicing in Cayman,” said Dr. Gerald Smith the Chairman of the Medical and Dental Council. “As a small country the Cayman Islands is not in a position to vet the qualifications of doctors wishing to practice here. We therefore selected a range of countries that is close to Cayman or from which we traditionally get many of our doctors.”
“Doctors who are not registered in any of the chosen countries could still be eligible for Cayman’s registration certificate,” he continued. “To be considered, however, they would have to write the board exam of any of the selected countries, or provide the HPC with documentation stating that their qualifications are recognized by any of these boards.”
So, the question is: Have ALL HCCI doctors met the Caribbean regional registration requirements, or written the board exams of any of the recognized countries listed above; or does the new Institutional Registration process void these requirements; and if it does void the requirements, how can patients have full confidence in doctors that have not met the stringent credentialing that “non-institutional” doctors (i.e., all doctors outside HCCI) must meet?
John John finds CayMas and trying to fix the dump ‘challenging’ but can sign off on this without batting an eye. You do the math.
I read the law and no where in it does it say DOCTORS … so all the practitioners, Doctors, Dentists, Nurses, Midwifes, Pharmacists, .. everybody now open up beyond the 6 years… an my poor God child caan get no job in her owna country,but dem indians don’t have to have propers qualifications
There are many Caymanians who are alive today because their heart condition or stroke, or whatever, was treated and their lives saved by, using your words, “dem indians” that “don’t have to have propers qualifications”. The staff there are very qualified and professional and the facility is the best equipped in the region. Why else do so many Caymanians go there if the care is not quality.
And for some reason we don’t like to talk of those who have died or are flat on their backs after being in the care of Health City. They should not be getting special treatment. A doctor has such a huge responsibility and together with other hospital staff can improve your health, make a condition worse or God forbid kill you. are these people we want to create short cuts for? Government, you are well paid. Please earn your salary and do what is right for the Cayman Islands.
9:07 what a nasty comment. Shame on you.
Doctors are not Gods. Redirect your nasty comments to your government for you live in health destroying environment and DON’T EVEN REALIZE THAT.
At least she can get a decent curry now though.
I’m alive today because of “dem indians” and I suspect many other Caymanians are as well. My neighbour is also one of the lucky ones. Shame on you for your derogatory remark.
Does anyone know if the changes were approved?
We’re doing the same old crap folks!!! The issue is not whether the hospital is good or the doctors are good. The issue is the creation of an uneven play field that benefits a few to the detriment of others… and as usual Caymanian doctors are included in the other category. We should be setting systems up properly in the first place to not cause issues for ourselves. One government makes a move that is against us. Another one comes along and says ‘oh but we like these people and they are so good to us so we need to continue the precedence.. or make it worse for us.’ Slaves. I am thankful for the hospital. But given it’s a proven success the protections should now come off, not be strengthened.
The change is about making the playing field more level. These doctors cannot work outside Health City because of licensing differences – fair enough. But they should not be discriminated agaonst and treated any differently from other foreigh medical practitioners who we allow to work here for 9 years. The change is correcting an unfair treatment and allowing very good doctors at Health City to continue caring for Caymanians a few years longer. That is it. Lets stop the discrimination please.
its still the best place east for lunch!
Great curry!
And probably the best medical facility on the Island bar none. Good food is extra gravy.
We should follow the UK system whereby public hospitals are required to publish records of their sepsis cases and serious errors in the operating theatre so that patients can make educated choices.
Yep, especially with Obstetrics.
This is exactly what Cayman needs! I want to make sure that I can continue to get quality healthcare at HC and this allows me to!
Try reading the article. The issue has nothing to do with the hospital. It’s whether a HC doctor can practice medicine here without meeting the same personal qualification and accreditation levels as other doctors.
And how long they can do it for.
Apparently the rules they asked for aren’t good enough any more and we are expected to accommodate them.
There are two options. Either India is added to the current 7 jurisdictions that are recognized or, that their staff are required to be licensed in one of the currently recognized jurisdictions. If not, it is again adding to the uneven playing field, which already exists with other exemptions that they benefit from.
Slacker you are so right. They are brilliant up there but they should be fully accredited and is the standard for other doctors on the island and the immigration law for them should be the same as for others. Why can’t they go to Jamaica and get their accreditation on a rotation basis, and any new doctors should have to go get the accreditation before being hired as is for all other doctors? With the level of skills kindness and attention shown at Health City that would really make them world class! I do not understand why anyone would balk over that. Remember it is the health of our people at stake here.
If you don’t like health city quit complaining and go to the one you like. Health city is doing great because so many people like them. I like them because they remind me of the good hospitals I have been to around the world. The other hospitals here not so much.
The real problem is that HCCI is constantly inviting Dwayne for free lunches and tours of the facility. They’ve ensured that he’s had his fair share of HCCI cool-aid and is now part of their team. Anytime you visit HCCI and see those partitions in the kitchen blocking the back off for privacy, you can bet yourself its usually a local politician being given a belly full and making deals and promises with HCCI. I’ve seen it to many times while I was waiting in their cafe on a family member to finish treatment.
On the other hand, many local doctors need to step up their game and start providing equal high-quality care to all and not just a select few. I’ve heard from several nurses, across several local clinics, on how many of their doctors refer many patients away for simple in office procedures. But will do those same simple in office procedures for a select few of their close friends who are a bit on the wealthier side. This type of favoritism in Cayman’s medical community is disgusting.
Then the local doctors complain when these big name medical players from overseas come down and “take their patients away.” Honestly, its because as a local I’ve never been treated better and had the highest quality care, than when I went away to a U.S. based healthcare facility. I urge all those who can have the opportunity to see a physician away, to give it a try and you will never regret it.
For all those nay-sayers about this fact, just remember when CIHSA or HCCI can’t treat you, where you will be sent away to…the U.S. #endofstory
When Cayman doctors couldn’t diagnose a “complex” patient, they were sending him to Miami.
Today, many diagnostic tests could be done in HC!
I am grateful to Dr. Lewis at HSA hospital for suspecting a rare condition and sending me with a nurse to Miami for specific tests which confirmed his suspicions (local doctors were saying I had an anxiety). Today, all the test that were conducted in Miami are available in HC.
So, please, be classy and “Cayman kind” and recognize par excellence of HC doctors.
Duhhhh-wayne jus doin what he’s told and gettin paid!
I was an out- patient at the Health City 2 years ago. I found them the staff that I were in contact with to be very professional, caring and I was pleased with the results. However I would feel better about the hospital if I ever have to undergo major surgery, even though they have had very successful results. At the risk of sounding uninformed I will ask if it is possible for these doctors to go on rotation to Jamaica, for instance sit their exams which would allow them to practice in most other jurisdictions.? Why wouldn’t our government require that? Certainly that would be a win for us and a win for them. As I said before they had had very good results but is it all based on knowledge or is some of it good karma? I hope this could be sorted out to our benefit.
I live in the US. I prefer to go to a recent foreign educated doctor, before they fully “americanize”. It is true they still have to comply to the T to over regulated medicine, but at least they didn’t forget yet what they learned in medical Schools and don’t freak out about “not scientifically proved” approaches to healing.
Say wah? So you’d rather go to a recent grad for life saving surgery because the med classes they took are more recent vs a veteran surgeon who’s done the surgery a hundred times? I guess you’d rather fly with a pilot who just got his license because his classroom training is fresher in his memory than a pilot who’s flown for 20 years…
Qualification of The Health City doctors, those who are from India, is superior to any doctor practicing in Cayman. They are in a different category from local and other expat doctors. Don’t you forget that before you start your usual rant. Different rules, indeed, should apply to them.
They require additional qualifications to work in the U.K. (& hence here without this law change). They could not get annual License outside of health city with their current qualifications.
Check the interview on Cayman Marl Road where an Indian doctor is explaining quite clearly why this should not go through as he had to sit additional qualifications to work in the U.K. /here (not at HC).
Does the government honestly want to pretend that a doctor who wants PR and applies, might not get it?
Stop buying into Seymours smoke. He wants this to be seen as whether or not doctors should be allowed to stay beyond 6 years. People like doctors, see them as wealthy and unlikely to be a burden on society, and in health city’s case see them as adding a good quality service. But it’s not really about the individual doctors and whether they stay or get rolled, is it? It’s about a specific investor and his Caymanian co investors being allowed to staff their businesses to a lesser regulatory standard than anyone else, and because if that, compete on price and /or make greater profit than established businesses. And in a profession where the industry regulations are to protect the public. The question has to be why.
The original suggestion – that there would be no unfair competition because they would only deal with medical tourists, and no risk to Caymanian public in the same logic, has proved to be false. So why, Dwayne, why. For all the generally held views about the quality of care at HC, that hospital is employing staff who do not have internationally recognized qualifications and because if that can pay them far less, to say nothing on the liability insurance savings they also make. You wouldn’t seriously suggest that one business working in the financial services sector should be allowed to employ accountants or lawyers without the requisite international lay recognized qualifications , or a new airline could set up without pilots with recognized licences, so why these guys?
Great response. No real surprises here it is the same formula at CIHC as Enterprise City and Tech City. Special rules for friends of CIG while the rest of us business owners deal with layer upon layer of fees and regulations.
Wonder if Ezzard will blame Jennifer for giving Dwayne bad advice on this as well?
so what about the immunity from lawsuits proposal as the amnendment was originally seeking?
Minister Seymour please withdraw this legislation. As a voter in BTE i urge u to. This is not good.
Explain why please. Is it because of the overwhelming number of successful well-trained caymanian doctor’s are unable to find jobs in Cayman?
No because it is not fair! Initially the rules where amended allowing HCCI Doctors to practice here with the understanding and agreemnent that it would only be for six years at a time. Now they are asking for this to change because why , according to Min Seymour, a patient is use to a doctor? C’mon. If HCCI doctors are allowed to stay longer than 6 years, they will be eligible to apply for PR and if received (which is very likely they would) could decide to leave HCCI and set up practice or work else where on island competing with those doctors who meet the standard criterial for practicing medicine in Cayman. By the way, I too have been a patient at HCCI and was satisfied with the level of care received. However, i believe that 6 years as per the original agreemnet should not be changed. There are many good doctors in India and recruiting them to work here in Cayman wont be that difficult. We as Caymanians need to stop being so willing to bend over backwards for everyone.
BTE Voter
Why are we protecting other Doctors from competition? No one protects mine. Maybe some of these high prices will come down. Are the local doctors maintaining their licenses?
They have to get their licenses renewed (check them on their office wall) and maintain required continued education. Their qualifications are more than those working at H.C.
The doctors at HC should not have been allowed to practice here without getting fully qualified but we can thank McKeeva for letting them in & now Seymour wanting to again give them special treatment.
Is there anything the CIG is doing to increase the number of local doctors that do meet requirements?
How… by forcing medical schools to take Caymanians ???
Ah, yes, the terrible incompetent Caymanian. It’s not at all possible for a country of our wealth to fund and improve the education and training of medical professionals for its own people.
I don’t think any ‘practitioners’ are leaving Health City to remain in C.I. Whatever the qualifications they staff at Health City must be doing something right as HSA keeps referring local patients to them. Perhaps they are better qualified that the doctors at George Town Hospital?
They’re not leaving because they can’t (without getting the extra qualifications the other doctors had to get to practice here). – But with this change, well, do you really believe they’ll be the ‘only’ people to ever come to Cayman and not want to stay. Which is not the issue. The issue is whether their ability to practice without the same qualifications as other doctors should be extended.
I remember the promise of separation from the traditional medical doctors as if it was this morning. My heart goes out to those who trusted the promise.
Minister Seymour is a great man and would only do what is right for Cayman. Just listen to him on the talk show with Roy & Gilbert.
lol – there appears to be a collective sense of humor failure… or just a lot of ignorance… hmmm…which could it be?
This not fair. The Health City arrangement regarding medical professionals clearly stated 6 years of work. Like every other work permit holder, they should be subject to “roll over” Furthermore, I believe all the other Medical Practioners on the Island, be they from the US, Canada, the UK and Europe have to meet much higher standards to qualify to practice than do the Doctors at Health City.
No one is subject to an automatic roll over now. Alden and company did away with it. Now everyone who wants PR can apply and get it, especially since they made the PR application process so easy.
Here are the facts for a 40 year old Indian doctor earning $99,000 in salary, with no investment in property, $5,000 in savings and a Caymanian nurse or intern reporting to them.
Occupation. 15
Experience. 10
Investment. 0
Education. 15
Financial Stability. 27
Community. 12
Culture Test. 15
Cayman Connections. 0
Demographics. 10
Age. 8
Total. 111 Points.
Guaranteed PR even with no local investment and no Caymanian relatives.
15 for the culture test? 27 for financial stability? 10 for Experience?
Methinks the poster gets 0 for the honesty test.
The facts are all in the response. A 99,000 salary with 5K in savings would guarantee 27 out of 30 for financial stability. 15 out of 20 on the culture test is conservative, particularly for an educated person.
This is not good. The other Doctors already practicing here have to meet much higher qualifying standards be they from the States, Canada or the UK and Europe. Just not fair to allow Health City interns the opportunity to apply for PR. Ezzard has hit the nail on the head!
Lord help us to make it to May 2021..
I am so sick and tired of this government.
John John, ask yourself if you are doing the right thing for Caymanians or setting precedent so that all these doctors can get their PR and open up their own business. Why can’t they leave for a year and come back like everyone else..oh wait nobody does that anymore..ugh!
Anything to prevent Health City becoming a ghost town. We need this hospital especially when CTMH Doctors Hospital is experiencing the same difficulties as when Dr. T. owned it outright.
What difficulties 7:56?
This Minister is clueless!!!
There was once a pharmacist years ago in Cayman Brac. He was called Dr. Lawrence.
He saved many lives and was loved by many.
The same way as Minister Dwayne Seymour commented on HCCI doctors.
When modern medicine became available did anyone turn him into a doctor?. Of course not. This is an example given to compare to HCCI doctors.
These doctors are only qualified in India yet they are allowed to practice here in Grand Cayman. They cannot practice in our mother country.
Why do we have 2 systems?
One for them – the unqualified.
One for the others who are qualified.
WRONG!
Health City Cayman Islands is a JCI-Accredited Hospital. In April 2015 the facility earned the prestigious Gold Seal of Approval from the Joint Commission International (JCI) and became a JCI-accredited hospital.
JCI is the international arm of The Joint Commission, the leading healthcare accreditor in the U.S.
JCI does not accredit practitioners, they accredit facilities based on their clinical policies and procedures. JCI does not “peer behind the veil” to see HOW practitioners were registered and granted licenses; JCI’s only mandate is to ensure that such licenses were granted. JCI does not delve into the back door that the 2013 Health Practice Law created thanks to Big Mac and his Fries
Anyone remember when we were first sold the fact that Health City would not operate locally and therefore it did not need to meet the same standards as other practitioners and McKeeva also made sure that he protected Gene by exempting HC from lawsuits. Now these practitioners leave HC and set-up their own practices to compete with fully licenced Doctors. Only in Cayman.
They need to go home. Get rolled over for one year and then come back. They may have saved many. But has anybody looked at the mortality rate in there also?
Can’t save the world. One person at the time.
Have you looked at mortality and cancer rates in Cayman?
Can’t even manage garbage collection but we’re made to believe that the Health City is in great hands. Hmm mmm
They can’t set up theirs own practices. Learn the law. Presumably you would also be moaning at how much CIG was spending on cardiac surgery in Miami if Health City wasn’t here too.
Lies. But that’s what you whiners want to hear. It is why you still listen to your representatives when all others will not.
YES! Drop your sense of entitlement and animosity towards ex-pats for a second – you’re saying that you don’t want more doctors on the island giving us more choice for which doctor to visit and pushing down prices. Really? You’re saying the poor, poor local Doctors don’t make enough money now and should be able to keep prices so high? Everyone keeps looking at this from a work permit / anti-expat viewpoint when this should be viewed from a local needing medical care viewpoint. Lower doctor prices and more doctor choices benefit 98% of the people in Cayman! Locals,
expats even tourists. Do your research before picking a doctor if you’re worried about their qualifications. C’mon – yours and all these comments are so narrow-minded. Poor, poor local doctors!!! Please cry me a river – just like we all do when we get a doctor’s bill these days.