Opposition challenges work permit vaccine bills
(CNS): The opposition is calling for government to pull proposed legislation to introduce mandatory COVID-19 vaccinations for work permit holders. PPM leader Roy McTaggart set out the position of the opposition in a letter sent Sunday, a day before the issue is due to be debated in Parliament and a day after a protest rally that drew several hundred people. Another demonstration is also scheduled to take place at the House of Parliament ahead of the sitting on Monday, as public concerns mount about any coercion regarding vaccination against the coronavirus.
In the letter addressed to Premier Wayne Panton, McTaggart said his members have serious concerns with the bills, which he said have implications that “go far beyond the scope of only work permit holders”.
He complained about the “scant public consultation”, the potential impingement on the rights and freedoms of spouses, civil partners, children and dependents of Caymanians, and described the bills as discriminatory and divisive.
In a change of position, given McTaggart’s wholehearted support for widespread use of the vaccine as a way to protect the community, he said the introduction of mandatory vaccinations will “in the end, provide no absolute meaningful protection from the virus since the vaccinated can also contract it and pass it on”.
McTaggart said the proposed amendments to the customs and border control and immigration laws unfairly “impact a broad cross-section of persons who we have invited here to work, invest, do business and live”, and if they become law will have a negative impact on Cayman’s economy and reputation.
Siding with a local law firm that has warned that the proposed vaccination mandates threaten rights protected under the Constitution, McTaggart said that while the current law requires non-nationals to prove they are not suffering from a communicable disease, being vaccinated against COVID is not an indication that a person does not suffer from this communicable disease.
“Only a suitable test for the presence of the virus before arriving and again after an appropriate quarantine period provides sufficient satisfaction that the person is not infected with the virus and able to transmit it,” McTaggart wrote, adding that the mandatory requirement to non-nationals only was unprecedented and breached the fundamental rights in Cayman’s Constitution and the European Convention.
“They have the potential to harm our Islands economically and reputationally and are divisive. As such, our view is that if the legislation is passed in its current form, it is likely to be declared incompatible with our constitution when, inevitably, it is challenged in the courts. What’s more, mandating vaccinations will have no appreciable impact on the trajectory of the current community spread of the virus,” he said, asking Panton to withdraw the bills.
The letter was sent to the premier after the peaceful rally outside Government House, the governor’s residence, drew significant support. Despite the current social gathering limits and social distancing requirements, organisers managed to stay within the law and make their point.
Several protesters were not just wearing protective masks but full face coverings, as well as hats, hoodies and dark glasses to cover up their identities, as some attendees may have been civil servants or workers worried that they could lose their job for joining the demonstration.
While many of the organisers are opposed to vaccination and continue to claim, without evidence, that it is dangerous and that government is hiding patients here who have had adverse reactions or “vaccine injuries”, there were also many people at the rally who claimed to be vaccinated but said they were concerned about the discrimination against work permit holders and the implications of mandating a vaccine, despite the mandatory vaccine programmes that already exist for children to go to school.
Some were there to promote the concept of vaccine choice, including Dr Steve Tomlinson, who is opposed to the approved and well researched Pfizer vaccine but appears to support the Sinopharm vaccine, developed by the China National Pharmaceutical Group, which has not yet received UK medical approval and has a much lower efficacy rate than the Pfizer shots currently being supplied by the British to all of its territories.
There were also others demanding a choice in medical treatment for those who are unvaccinated and become ill, including Ivermectin and hydroxichloroquine, two drugs which have become politicized and bogged down in a maelstrom of misinformation. In India’s recently revised ‘Clinical Guidelines’ for COVID-19 both these drugs have been dropped from recommended use.
The HSA has said that it has a full treatment regime available for anyone unfortunate enough to be hospitalised due to the virus and has successfully treated around two dozen people for COVID-19 since March 2020.
Parliament is due to meet at 10am and will be broadcast live on government social media pages and on CIGTV.
See the opposition leaders letter in the CNS Library.
- Fascinated
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I agree, people should have a right to choose.
1. Legalize abortion now
2. Legalize assisted suicide now
3. Legalize gay marriage now
Abortion should only be allowed after both parties responsible for the conception have signed off.
Rapists????
So you are saying,let the man decide? SMH
Currently, all work permit holders must have and AIDS test when applying to work. So what is the big deal about a vaccine?
Hopefully the facebook hack with Insta, Fba nd whatsapp being down, will prevent the fake vaccine news for a day and increase the vaccination rate.
Oh boy,in the demonstration that they had Saturday and again on Monday wasn’t only Jamaican I saw it was every nation includes caymanian ,it’s not only Jamaican that don’t want the vaccine every body that is on work permits majority of them don’t want to take the vaccine and I wonder why,when you goes to Rome you do what the Romans,come to drink the milk not to count the cows,in every country the governments have rules,go by rules are less
What’s the point of being vaccinated? No point…zzzzzzzzzz
Suppose I am trying to get sick cant you all just leave me alone?
#mychoice #youhavenoclue
Mostly only Jamaicans on work permits that are kicking against getting the Vaccine .
If the PPM was in power they would do the same thing. They really don’t want to stop this Act coming into effect because they care about our health and their own.
As a Jamaican WPH with 18 Jamaican WPH friends in my inner circle, … contrary to your crap … WE ALL ARE VACCINATED … its the Caymanians who are the hold outs … we all have family elsewhere and need to travel to see family, so we took our vaccines, so much so, mone are due to get boosters.
no one is being forced to be vaccinated.
but to protect public health(like all other first world countries) unvaccinated will face restrictions.
for example:
to drive a car and protect others…you need to be tested, have insurance and carry proof of passing a test.
does this sound familar to anybody?
If you think this is where it ends then I’m glad you are happy living under the boot of tyranny. The issue today is that the power is acquired by pointing out some threat. This year, the ‘unvaccinated’ are the threat.
If they decide to clear us out, which you would probably be ecstatic about like a little modern Stalin, there needs to be another threat to combat. In today’s age of ideas, yours will soon come under the scope of the state which we have allowed to get too big, then you will call out for others to help you and they will make references and comparisons just like you did failing to observe context.
Sooner or later, everyone becomes the enemy.
Sheep go Bahhhh
Great effort, but you can’t reason with the mob. The mob seizes high moral ground and then congratulates itself for forcing compliance. The mob has no individual reason, but that of a hive mind.
Those that think for themselves are always willing to change their minds in the face of vetted evidence. What I have seen lately is the complete disregard for any semblance of discussion. Nope. The mob is all powerful, and it has identified the enemy.
4:33, – I’m not sure what conspiracy you’re promoting, – ‘vetted evidence’ for the vaccine is widespread and easily available. The system is working, Roy & The Opposition are voicing your concerns even though it could be argued he was part of your problem in saving your a$$ and stricter tyranny by forcing compliance when in power during lockdown.
Who is the tyrant you dear and do you honestly believe you might be ‘cleared out’ by someone who will soon declare themselves as dictator and send you to the ‘gulag’ or next NRA project 🙄
@2:03PM
Yours is the same rhetoric that is played out by both parties in the USA. This is Cayman, not the USA although if you look at all the pro-Trump facebook posts from some in Cayman, you would think we belong to the USA instead of the UK..
More like go to another country, meet all the requirements for a driving test, get a license and then a car, then the govt says you can no longer drive a car cos your an expat. See how stupid your analogy is now.
The Government’s first responsibility is to the people of these Islands. In order to do its best to protect Caymanians and residents the Government will require vaccines for work permit holders – people who have the choice to return to their homeland. This is my home I have nowhere to go. These little islands are not equipped to cope with hundreds or thousands of COVID infections, and vaccines are the best way to avoid that. I thank Premier Panton and his Government for being bold enough to bring this unpopular bill.
Since there are more foreigners here than locals the opposition will be strong, we are a minority in our own country, we allowed that to happen. We have no choice but to stay here among the thousands who refuse to protect themselves and thus increase the risk for the rest of us. They have a choice.
Wow!! PPM is massively missing the point that vaccination dramatically reduces a person’s risk of infection and ability to transmit this virus. Breakthrough infections can occur, but occur on an incredibly small scale compared to the level of infection and transmission that occurs in unvaccinated persons.
I thought they had more sense than to undermine vaccine credibility. No words.
Reduces the risk of death, not infection.
CNS: Not true. NBC – Vaccinated people are less likely to spread Covid, new research finds
Does reducing transmission stop the spread? Love to see that study. Even if the (not yet peered reviewed) study is valid, we’re talking about a net reduction of 10% over Alpha. A year ago we would be saying the vaccine will reduce your risk of infection by 10% therefore let’s mandate vaccines even though there’s a 90% chance it won’t make any difference in infection.
A slow moving train wreck.
You don’t have a clue what you’re talking about
Wrong. No vaccine prevents or makes any difference for you passing it to another person who’s had a vaccine or not.
CNS: NBC – Vaccinated people are less likely to spread Covid, new research finds
CNS – you should read the research directly or at least the entirety of the NBC article you linked.
Unfortunately it says that after 3 months the effect of the vaccines drops to almost negligble when it comes to transmission.
*CNS: My head now hurts after bashing it against the wall. I think this is the paragraph you are referring to and have apparently not understood: “The new study showed that protection against transmission seemed to wane over time, however. After three months, people who had breakthrough infections after being vaccinated with AstraZeneca were just as likely to spread the delta variant as the unvaccinated. While protection against transmission decreased in people who had received the Pfizer vaccine, there was still a benefit when compared with people who were unvaccinated.
I’m not saying this to support the anti-vaxxers’ position. I think they are wrong to reject the vaccine because it provides lasting benefits against serious illness and death.
But the point these people are making about transmission is relevant. We are making serious policies based on the premise that unvaccinated people are more dangerous to be around than unvaccinated people. If that ends up to be true only be for a couple months, does that justify costing someone their residency or their job? Because that’s what we are talking about in some cases.
Absolutely 100% wrong. Director of the CDC just admitted that the vaccine doesn’t stop spread.
https://www.realclearpolitics.com/video/2021/08/06/cdc_director_vaccines_no_longer_prevent_you_from_spreading_covid.html#!
And if that isn’t enough, just look at Israel which has had its worst outbreak AFTER reaching 80% vaccination rate.
The vaccine is highly effective at lowering hospitalizations and deaths but does not substantially lower the spread.
Why its only in Caymanian that’s not got it mandatory for work permits holders need to get the Vaccine . Jamaicans are the only ones complaining about getting the Vaccine. Hondurans, Philippines , British, Americans etc are ok for it and wants to get the Vaccine.
I’m British and I’m moving the family back to U.K. just because of this mandated vaccine. I’m not having it
Don’t let the tea and crumpets hit you on the way out.
I’ll take ‘Highly unlikely scenario’ for $200
bye
Have fun with paying 50% tax
I’m yet to meet a Jamaican that is complaining about taking the vaccine. Show me your company and I’ll tell you who you are.
The virus is here and it’s not going away anytime soon. The vaccination rate is high enough now to justify opening the border and dropping quarantine requirements completely. If people choose not to get vaccinated they will have to live with the consequences up to and including death. If the hospitals get to capacity treating unvaccinated people for Covid those people should be sent home if someone who is vaccinated needs the bed for an unrelated issue.
Let me set this clear. If I align with any party its PPM.
That said….
PPM, Alden and McTaggart. It’s time to stop the attacking and start building a better mouse trap to allow us to open. This means working with PACT to create laws that for vaccination compliance. Get together and figure out a means to supersede what needs to be to get mandated vaccines in place.
THIS IS NO TIME TO TRY TO GAIN POLITICAL POINTS!!!
Even us who do not like the reopening at this time will side with us doing what is needed to protect our people, sometimes sadly, even from their stupid selves.
You know I have never been so let down to hear so many of my, I thought they had brains, Caymanians YOUNG and OLD, spout utter stupidity. I honestly thought the USA held the exclusive PATENT on that level of stupidity but I stand corrected.
Alden & Roy, our national heroes. Anything to try to bring down the current goverment and get themselves into power.
1:34 pm, you are 100 % right, Cayman really have lots of stupid foolish people. We though Roy was a sensible common sense man. But now we see he has no common sense. He only wants to go against PACT for the reason of going against PACT and follow the leader.
So what is the PPM’’s plan or alternatives? Nothing!!
Thankfully the PPM are not in charge. They’ve been quite vocally stating their objection to reopening the border and want it to stay closed until this is over. Even the Speaker weighed-in on that score. Whereas, sensible people are fine waiting out 1-2 mos to get booster doses into arms of >50yr olds when they arrive mid-month ahead of a soft reopening. I was in North America for 6 months, and nothing is normal anywhere right now.
Probably making them wear a bell and carry a sign that says “Unclean”. PPM don’t give a rats about about permit holders, never have, this is just stupid politics.
Fuddy Duddy strikes again.. Can even string two of Alden’s words together to make a sentence without messing up ..
We don’t need any party. A website would be more useful to see what the people of cayman want or don’t want.
The treatment costs are high and the work permit holder may have only basic insurance. Hence if vaccinated he may have less severe condition. Hence mandating is ok as we have mandated HIV testing for same reason of cost and not because he will transmit.
Mandating requirement of vaccination if u are of a particular job for all residents dealing with public as it gives higher risk of getting infected and transmission as unvaccinated may have higher viral load.
Unvaccinated shldnt have right to certain public places.
Unvaccinated sick should not be entitled for free treatment.
Despite the vaccinated being “less likely to spread” COVID the fact is they can still get it, they can still die of it (particularly if there are risk factors such as obesity and diabetes or other diseases) and they can still pass it on. As the % of vaccinated increases, inevitably so to does the number of vaccinated people who get it when there is community spread. More than likely it was a vaccinated person coming back in with only a 5 day quarantine that kicked off the latest community spread rather than some healthy unvaccinated person here minding their own business not hurting anybody. We don’t know the long term effects of the new “vaccines”. Check the FDA website for drugs and other products that are no longer approved due later discovering they cause cancer. Common drugs used for years like Metformin and Tagamet. Look it up.
I looked it up. Both of those medications are still approved and in fact metformin is on the WHO’s list of essential medicines. Both have been involved in research on PREVENTING cancer.
Thankfully, I wont have to worry about you attending the same gym as me, because unvaccinated are legally not allowed in.
Yes because gyms are just so sanitary. You will be laughing the other side of your face when a vaccinated person with covid sweats all over the equipment you just wiped down with your ineffective towel!
There is no evidence that it was a person doing a five day quarantine. It’s just as likely it was a quarantine breach involving an unvaccinated person.
Or a quarantined person who decided 5 days was too much and breached. Where would an unvaccinated person go ?
SO. lets say the population of Grand Cayman is 60.000 and if 300 people showed up, that, if my math is correct is about 1/2 of a percent of the population of Grand… And they want special treatment.. ahhhhh if you are on a work permit, you are a guest, if the gov’t requires you to be vaccinated, do it, or go back to wherever you originated from… Anti vaxxer’s are just following suit from the right winged neophytes in the U S. With over 700.000 dead so far.. Good luck Cayman..
I’m sitting here watching while Alden is talking at length and grinning as he is speaking..I thought Roy was the Premier, why did he have so little to say and Alden is leading the charge…..some things never change.
Sorry I meant to say while Roy is grinning..
The key point here is being missed- work permit holders are not going to be mandated to get vaccinated immediately and mid-term of their existing permit.
This is just for new grants and renewals (which is effectively a new grant anyway).. people aren’t being forced to get vaccinated – it’s their choice. It’s just that a condition of getting a new permit is that vaccination is required. The person still has a choice and no one has a right to a new work permit.
It’s a different scenario which is being twisted and misunderstood.
It’s a reasonable demand .
Correct, so if you don’t want to be vaccinated with a new technology with no long term studies that also seems to have lost a tremendous amount of it’s glitter, quit your job, sell your house, pull your kids out of school and leave. It’s no big deal.
Same would have to happen if some Caymanian was available and able to do your job. That’s how it works, there’s no job security if you’re on a WP.
The difference being that risk was calculated and accepted based on skill and confidence in advance.
If you aren’t Caymanaian it’s not your right to be here. Don’t like the laws, head back to your homeland. We’ve made it too easy for you to ship your entitlement when you shipped your furniture. Stop asking us to accept your sour attitude when you’d never accept it from us if the roles were reversed. Come see me working in your homeland on a permit and then fighting your government for putting stipulations on my permit renewal.
If I understand you correctly, what you are saying is there is no amount of injustice that can imposed on a work permit holder that would cause you to answer the question of what is right and what is wrong.
If fully vaccinated can get it and spread it why aren’t they loosing their jobs?
Because we won’t clog up the hospitals.
Sure you do, we could probably get by with one hospital if not for all the smokers,drunks, drug addicts and obese.
Because they can write 4th grade English?
A couple of things.
Firstly, I wished I’d thought to create a pop up store selling tin foil hats.
Secondly, I just can’t with these people. There’s probably a good few who had to travel together as they share a brain cell.
I would join you in your new venture with some MAGA And Q hats. We could have set up shop in front of the Governors house last Saturday.. would have saved Dr. T all that money he spent on giving out free t-shirts.
Us MAGA folks are mostly vaccinated, thanks to Trump kicking the FDA into giving approval.
LOL! You MAGA people live in Wally World…
https://www.google.com/amp/s/www.cnbc.com/amp/2021/08/22/trump-booed-at-alabama-rally-after-telling-supporters-to-get-vaccinated.html
https://www.nytimes.com/interactive/2021/04/17/us/vaccine-hesitancy-politics.html
So know Alden and Kattina are on the same platform..You can’t make this stuff up.
Alden very much believes in the concept of “the enemy of my enemy is my friend” when it comes to politics.
Cayman literally turns a blind eye to drunk people driving around without their headlights on. This protest is on the same echelon of ridiculous permissiveness. It’s not about freedom of choice, these are micro-rebellions against society’s health and safety standards that wind up burying non-participants. No difference. Coroner will find it as “death due to misadventure”.
Poor Roy, digging himself into a deeper hole..Opposition for Opposition sake.
I wonder if he realizes that Alden is waiting in the wings to take his premier job back?
Alden is doing nothing of the sort… were do you come u with this drivel
Priemier is only a 2 term of 4 years each. Alden can’t be Priemer again. The question is can he be Deputy Premier,?
@12:13pm are you watching the same debate I am? Poor Roy is just sitting there and Alden has been rambling on for hours reading a letter from Kattina’s lawyer. Roy debate for the most 15 minutes and kept stumbling over his prepared statement..
Who’s in charge on the opposition side?
Why are the opposition going against the Government just for the hell of it. They should be working with the Government trying to protect and keep all people living on these Caymanian Islands safe. They the opposition should be ashamed of themselves.
Good bye freedom. Hello Safety. Small price to pay to those who pay nothing.
Pay nothing. Other than the indirect taxes levied on me and my employees? Those supporting the maintenance of the current system are those that pay nothing – cushy job in the civil service where you are not required to be vaccinated or have a work permit.
What? Work permit holders generate and pay more to the government than caymanians do.
One minute we are trying to get rid of work permit holders the next we are sticking up for thier rights!
The anti-vaxxers are using them to promote their agenda.. They couldn’t care less about work permit holders..it is a means to their ends..
Why its only in Caymanian that’s not got it mandatory for work permits holders need to get the Vaccine . Jamaicans are the only ones complaining about getting the Vaccine. Hondurans, Philippines , British, Americans etc are ok for it and wants to get the Vaccine.
Some of these people, including Roy, are simply a waste of oxygen.
I no longer concern myself or wish to fight for the freedoms of those who want me to either comply with their way of thinking or die.
I’m tired of the people of my island being uncultured, uneducated fools. I stand on principles of freedom which benefit everyone and a subset of everyone would probably prefer I die because I don’t think like them and actively seek to coerce me into falling in line.
It is clear we do not have the same principles and that’s disheartening because deep down I truly wish all of us could find common ground. I’m fighting for freedom of choice, if you wish to place yourself in the middle of it then consider yourself and enemy.
Until the mandate includes all registered voters, it won’t have my support.
Was the nuisance helicopter cover really necessary to handle a few dozen protesting dummies? Aren’t (even dummy) folks allowed to peacefully assemble in a free country? Don’t the RCIPS have ground units that could have managed a placid ground situation better than an air unit? How is the air unit supposed to tackle a dumb dumb with an open pitcher of swanky? Felt like there was a terror attack, or active shooter manhunt underway. Another RCIPS response overkill, and public relations/trust backfire against the people of WBS trying to enjoy their Sunday.
I thought they were there to protect the rights of the freedom lovers from you. Good thing right?
The helicopter, loitering at 500ft, a quarter mile away from a scheduled peaceful event, at $$$$$/hr, can’t do anything to control, or direct response to a terrestrial situation happening out of their view. Ergo, an aerial nuisance for those homes directly under their hover for over an hour. Time for some flight zones, and new minimum altitude CIAA laws for that thing, outside when they are in the emergency pursuit of something.
The ‘vaccines’ provided to government are free and in effect there is no choice of vaccine, it is pfizer or nothing else. The proposed law says you must be vaccinated, but they are really saying you have to have pfizer only. Not only are they discriminating and divisive, they are supporting pfizer which is very very wrong.
no it doesn’t..It says a vaccine course..Work permit holders coming from other countries have many choices..and if a work permit holder already here doesn’t like the free ones we have here they can get a on a flight to USA before November and the have a wide choice of all of the approved vaccines. Remember after November you cannot go into the USA without being unvaccinated.
Yeh they will be lining up to pay an airfare to get a vaccine. You missed the point entirely. Government requiring you to get vaccinated with the only vaccine they have because it was free. I certainly would have preferred a protein subunit vaccine and incorporating a lab-made coronavirus spike protein and an ingredient called an adjuvant that makes the body’s immune response stronger.
@2:17 You are one of the reasons we will take forever to get out of this mess. We are one small country and we have two vaccines, Pfizer and Astrazenica. If we had brought in John and Johnson or Moderna you wouldn’t have want those either. You are an anti-vaxxer whether you want to admit it or not.
I was hoping that Dr. T. would be approved to sell you and the other idiots wanting “choices” the Sinopharm but went he found it it wasn’t approved in the Western world, he decided he would be an anti-vaxxer.. At least the ones from the Government are free..How much did you think Dr. T would have charged you for the Chinese Vaccine..and if you believe that one is better than Pfizer then you have no sense.
It’s the best vaccine along with Moderna and Oxford. If they were mandating some communist untested vaccine like russian sputnik or a chinese one, i understand your concern, but for Pfizer this is not a valid complaint.
The best vaccine available? Says who? Try reading up on non mrna vaccines, it isn’t just communists that produce these.
It’s the safest vaccine on the market. Moderna has even more adverse events tied to it. We are lucky to be given access to life saving vaccines for no cost to the individual. There are people in other countries that could only dream of being offered any shot, let alone the Pfizer. Why be picky and just get it now that it has full FDA approval for both safety and efficacy.
Why are we not being offered the AstraZeneca? It was approved by the Mother country. Moreover, why are people so dead set against choices? You, I assume, did tons of vetted research and made an informed decision, right? Right?
So you want everyone to be forced into your same decision? If the point is to get everyone vaccinated, we should offer the AZ also. It was offered months ago, but just briefly. I got the AZ jab during that time, with zero ill effects.
Some of you, though, aren’t happy with that. Some of us want everyone to be made to have the same choice. Do you wonder why that is? I do.
Australia disagrees with you. Pfizer is not prescribed for all age groups
Sorry to let you know, but if you do not support equal rights for EVERYONE, including the LGBQT/transgender community, if you do not support a woman’s right to make decisions about her body, and yes, I mean abortion rights also,
YOU DO NOT get to play the “MY BODY MY CHOICE’ card.
Full. Stop.
These are all different issues with different complexities. You can’t conflate them all into one.
@11:59am – nope, I don’t think you’re correct. You don’t get to cherry pick what rights you support when you’re screaming “my body my choice”. It works for EVERYONE.
No they are the same. If you think your right to decide what you want to do with your body is only okay when it has to do with what you don’t want to do but force another human to do what you think they should and shouldn’t do than you are the same person you’re protesting against.
I bet some of these people campaigning against vaccine mandates are also anti-abortion. Absolute hypocrites.
You are so deliciously superior, I am near faint in your presence.
Thank you! The comparative to abortion rights is just so blatant to the point that they stole the protest signs! the laws in Cayman concerning abortion are so antiquated to the point of relegating the women here to 2nd class citizens. If you are out there opposing vaccine mandates that are simply tied to a job you are a hypocrite if you don’t also support a woman’s right to her own body.
I support a baby’s right to life. Just imagine if your mother chose to abort.
Please leave the idiots alone, they have the right to choose an untimely death sooner if they want too😂. The bigger problem is their spreading disease because of their ignorance. Thankfully, ignorance isn’t a disease and there’s no cure either.
Roy is the Parliament reading Alden’s speech and constantly tripping himself up. I’m dying laughing!
I assume these people sputing ‘my body my choice’ are also anti-abortion and will be campaigning for abortions to be legal here too? Same thing.
Also, someone not getting vaccinated is no worse than a drunk driver and should be ashamed of themselves. You are deliberately putting others at risk – no different to driving under the influence.
Absolute nonsense – abortion is a different issue, and is directly and intentionally killing a human life.
You should be ashamed of yourself for conflating the two, and thinking it’s ok to mandate these relatively new vaccines on people. In case you want to call me an “anti-vaxxer”, I am vaccinated, and believe in their efficacy, but don’t believe in mandating them or discriminating against the population based on them.
So you are saying that you won’t take the vaccine because it may kill you but isn’t that the same thing as abortion? If you get jabbed and die isn’t that taking your life? Don’t be an idiot..
@ 12:04pm – Nope, that argument does not work. You don’t get to scream “my body my choice” as an excuse to not take a life saving vaccination during a world wide pandemic, because that suits you and your beliefs, but then refuse to uphold that same right “my body my choice” because someone has a different believe than you.
I believe that if a fetus cannot survive outside of it’s mother’s body, it’s not a human life.
So, “My Choice, My Body”.
Me having the right to have an abortion does not affect your life or your life choices. Unlike, someone who refuses to take a life saving vaccination during a pandemic.
“I believe that if a fetus cannot survive outside of it’s mother’s body, it’s not a human life.” – what a disgusting thing to say.
well its true
Freedom to choose is freedom to choose and includes not only abortion but also marriage.
Nope… a human is only considered alive while brain activity is detected. Which for a fetus that is roughly 25 weeks. So anything before that is my body my choice.
I don’t think your brain developed properly. Life begins when the cell divides, law of nature not man. Just more convenient for man so we don’t have to call it murder.
No. But nice try
Same thing to me. Just choosing what you have in your body in both cases.
for the love of God, would you morons get it through your heads that people who are not vaccinated pose no threat to those of you who are vaccinated. Your idol, the CMO confirmed this during his “talk with the experts” piece he did for the Compass.
And statistically speaking, in Cayman, you have a greater chance of being killed by a drunk driver than being hospitalized or killed from C-
@12:05pm..So who has said that on here that you are referring your remarks to?
But… in order to protect the vaccinated we need to inject the unvaccinated with the very same thing that didn’t protect the vaccinated.
I mean, its sound logic right?
You lack understanding. Maybe grab another anti vaxxer and rub your heads together to see if the half a brain cell you each use sparks a startup chain reaction to turn on more cells.
This is not true. Unvaccinated covid patients have filled hospitals in many places to the point that vaccinated people with other medical conditions cannot get care.
Unvaccinated people also have a greater chance of getting covid. If you get covid and send your positive kid to school, I can end up having to quarantine for 14 days which means I can’t go work.
McTaggart flip flopping like a fish out of water…
Again, instead of offering an opposing/differing solution, he offers criticism. This is not what an effective opposition looks like!
Good grief. If I were effecting policy, the only part of universal vaccination that would justify waivers would be (a) proof of equivalent antibody levels via previous exposure/recovery with an accompanying antibody titre lab, or (b) a qualifying note of exemption from a doctor. These aren’t experimental emergency use authorization vaccines anymore. They have had full FDA approval for over a month, with hundreds of millions served. The immunizations are in the same camp as measles etc. and we aren’t staring down the barrel of a measles outbreak, like we are with delta variant. It’s a pity some people don’t realize how fortunate they are to have access to these. That access is a material and significant positive for our territory’s reputation and why people want to come here to live, play, and work. Roy should gargle with mouthwash after spewing the dirty opposite!
Sorry – this is incorrect – even the studies linked from the CDC website state that more studies are needed to determine whether there are any long term adverse effects on children whose mother took the vaccine while pregnant. It will be years before we have that data and it should certainly be a choice in the interim.
garbage from roy who is playing politics….what is ppm’s plan then if they now don’t believe in the vaccine.
mena while the rest of the world is moving ahead with restrictions for the unvaxxed…..zzzzzz
I suppose most of these people opposing getting the vaccine are those on work permits. How are they going back if their countries require vaccination for covid to enter back?
I really don’t understand these people either. No vaccine means:
– Cannot travel to US at all
– Would have to pay for quarantine and quarantine up to 14 days both in Cayman and in the few countries that will let you in
– If you can get to ay other country that lets you in, after expensive quarantine and PCR testing, you likely can’t enter bars/shops/restaurants as many have vaccine passport systems
– You put yourself and others in danger with a much higher chance of catching, spreading and dying from the virus
Why would anyone choose not to get jabbed?
1) People who never leave the island anyway, and have no intention of doing so
2) those who believe the vaccine was developed using foetuses (without really knowing anything about it) and are therefore opposed on moral grounds
3) those who are more frightened of the vaccine, which is an immediate “threat”, than the catching Covid – which given the last 2 years, they feel is really unlikely and not too serious.
Add to this list, in Cayman, can no longer go to a gym, play squash, indoor cycling, dance exercise, go to a yoga studio.
😱
Does stop you burning your energy in the great outdoors does it?
for now, but with due process in the courts, all of these mandates will be struck down
Haha try again, my pillow guy.
Maybe they are not interested in going to the US or Canada to catch covid. Maybe they are interested in just staying here. Maybe they are not interested in Pfizer that is still doing human trials and no clue about long term side effects. The vaccines don’t work, you are 6 months behind in the narrative, they wane. The vaccinated are the cause of this latest outbreak when the quarantine was reduced to 5 days. The higher chance of spreading it is the vaccinated with their higher viral loads.
WOW You have got everything wrong EVERYTHING
They spend too much time on Facebook cooking their minds under the tinfoil hats they made…
The constant Facebook insult is old. It just gives away how much of an NPC you actually are.
Classic signature insults of the NPC that traverses the Cayman News Service website include:
“Trumpian”
“Facebook science”
“Tinfoil hats”
“Conspiracy theorists”
“Fox News watcher”
“Tucker Carlson watcher”
You don’t seem to realize how this makes you look. The same insults always come out and its always evident that YOU have one enemy and its the same enemy you conjured up in your heads from 2016. That anyone ‘right wing-ed’ is all the same. You don’t realize you are in a massive echo chamber on this website. People laugh at comments like you because you can only vomit what the mainstream media has to say.
If it didn’t come from CNN, Rachel Maddow, Don Lemon, Fredo and the rest of the gang then its all Trump. Your perspective operates in their only being two sides. You’re too dumb to realize this entire thing is much more than the TV makes you think.
Sheep go Bahhh
Oh dear, another maniac posting nonsense again.
Amen!
that’s why they don’t want it..then they can say they can’t leave here and we have to give them permanent residency.
Bless your cotton socks, thankfully PR doesn’t work that way.
Wrong – there are a lot of Caymanians who are opposed to getting the vaccine. The majority of WP holders are likely vaccinated. Hence the reason that this bill is kind of pointless, and won’t have any material effect, other than creating more divisiveness.
No unvaccinated permit holder should be allow to arrive on these islands. They must be vaccinated or else stay home, wherever that is. If you can’t abide by the laws of the country, then do not come.
Majority of non-Jamaican WP holders
This is nothing more than politrics. Just simply opposing for the sake of opposition.
Roy, you above all, are bigger and better than this. Stop this foolishness and stand for something in your life other than what Alden wants!
Vaccines should be made mandatory throughout the entire Country.
Get back under your bridge!
Good! This bill is completely discriminatory in its current form. Either mandate all people in the Cayman Islands (including Caymanians) to get it, or none.
I am personally vaccinated, but believe that there should be no vaccine mandate. It’s not going to have much material difference to the vaccination rate anyway, as it is more likely that Caymanians are unvaccinated than WP holders, etc.
This mandate will likely do more damage economically and reputationally to the Cayman Islands than Covid will.
Work Permit and Permanent Resident conditions and rules are inherently deeply discriminatory. Objecting to proof of mandatory vaccination on grounds of fairness, would open the door to questioning logic of TB chest xrays, or AIDS tests, or maximum number of dependents, professional designation/degree/experience qualifications, home equity benchmarks, etc etc. Where would you propose the CIG switch off their unfairness criteria for temporary guest workers? How would that help Caymanians? Can’t have it both ways.
Perhaps all those other issues should be investigated too. Let’s not add more discrimination into the mix.
You are vaccinated? Boy have I heard that so many times from the anit-vaxxers..We wouldn’t be here if as many of you say you are vaccinated would go and get vaccinated.
“Anti-vaxxer” is a classic attempt at discrediting anyone who you don’t agree with.
I say I’m vaccinated because I am, and I believe the vaccines work. Just don’t believe in mandating them.
Why are people who are opposing 1 vaccine automatically categorized as antivaxxers?
People have received all the other “childhood immunizations” but have never gotten a flu shot, and dont want this one either and we place them in the antivax category?!
We arent anti vaxxers, we just dont want this pointless garbage in our bodies. We want natural immunity to be recognized.
Wow, how ignorant are you. That’s a rhetorical question as it’s obvious how stupid you really are. Yes I am vaccinated and yes I believe in Freedom of Choice and so do MANY of my vaccinated friends.
As a former WP holder and PR, I support the Premier and the PACT gov 100% in their position. The mandate of the Govt is to serve and protect the Caymanian people and residents of these islands. Immigration is not a right, it is an opportunity granted to those who so qualify and that means meeting the criteria outlined in our Immigration Policy. However, I agree that those already resident here should not be forced. No Law should be retroactive. We are a country of freedoms. If you are dissatisfied with our Laws, then you are free to go elsewhere.
Agreed. I’m also a former WP/PR holder and I would have had no problem with this whatsoever either to come to Cayman in the first place, or to apply for PR, or even to apply for status. I didn’t particularly want to have an HIV/syphilis test and TB x-ray as part of the WP process, but that was a public health requirement. I can understand the challenge of mandating for Caymanians (and even PR holders) but there is surely nothing to stop a mandate for certain occupations – lawyers jump in here.
If the PPM thinks that there is not already some sort of societal division between Caymanians and “others”, they are kidding themselves. WP holders face the prospect of their WP not being renewed for all sorts of reasons and not just because there is a qualified Caymanian who can do the job (which is entirely appropriate) – an altercation in a car park with someone who complains to Immigration, an HR dispute with a junior member of staff who complains to Immigration, being two examples that spring to mind. Haven’t we seen calls for certain high profile members of the community to be “kicked off the island” because people don’t like what they have to say? Cayman is a wonderful place to live, but let’s not pretend that Caymanians and WP holders are not already treated differently both in law and in practice.
What I don’t understand now though is the fixation on vaccination at the same time as neither the CIG nor the PPM seems prepared to rely on a high vaccination rate to take a balanced policy approach to recent community spread.
ohh its so funny that the people spewing this nonsense about the vaccine, that others “must go elsewhere” wasnt saying that to the LGBTQAZXVY crowd when they wanted to change the laws.
Govt should ensure that the vaccine is available to those who want to take it. They should not be mandating that others shoot chemicals into their body, just for so. As we have seen over the last 2 weeks, the vaccinated catch and spread it, so the vaccine is pointless.
The ruling parties mandate on work permit holders says one thing : We don’t consider it necessary for Caymanians & the Civil service to be vaccinated . Considering that perhaps 95% of any permit holders will arrive already vaccinated .
No it doesn’t say that..that is what you are inferring it says..get your facts straight.
I’m so sick of the PPM. They are such opportunists..
Vaccines reduce illness and hospitalizations and length of hospitalizations. Treating COVID patients once hospitalized is a very labor intensive, costly process.
That is the reason all work permit holders (who are guest workers in this country) should be required to be vaccinated, as it is the Cayman hospital system, and not their home country’s, that get stressed and stretched by work permit holder hospitalization. This has a deleterious effect on hospital services for others.
This is not a work permit holder’s country. If you could theoretically be treated in your home country, fine. But if you get sick in Cayman you will be treated in Cayman.
So what’s new? These is the PPM modus operandi.
They will jump on any bandwagon and once again change their position to figure out a way to get them themselves relevant again..
Bunch of sore losers!
Ah the “I’m not an antivaxxer but…” crowd.
How many are Caymanian?
You do realize that is a bill to enforce that all work permit holders must be vaccinated before coming to the island or on the renewal of their work permit.
Most of the Caymanians out there are being told that they are being forced to get vaccinated under this law which is entirely untrue.
Do we want to continue to stay in this lockdown forever? You cannot go to another man’s country and dictate to them their rules..Let get on with this.
Work permits now Caymanians after lunch.
This is ridiculous – does anyone really believe that Roy wouldn’t be doing the exact same thing if he was in power? He would be doing everything that he could to open up the island in a safer way. I support having an opposition but opposing something just for the sake of opposing it, is not good for the country.
Just glad I no longer have to be subjected to nauseating renditions of Baby Shark as a result.
OMG!!!!
WTH is going on here???
With one breathe we hear “Open Cayman up” and the next I won’t take the vaccine. How the heck are these two concepts going to coexist?
People to open up and not have people dying you all need get the shot or face discrimination. You need to understand that WHILE you have the choice right now to not vaccinate you do not have the right to infect everyone. Business should refuse service, refuse to hire and government should refuse permits because its their rights also.
So let’s go by your IDIOT logic. Your theory is that the government does not have the right to impinge your freedoms because its your choice to not vaccinate.
So by that logic.
1. We do not have the right to make you isolate since that’s impinging your rights.
2. Hell we should not even be able to force a PCR test since that is discrimination.
3. Why can they tell you which vaccine is good. Maybe you feel orange juice is sufficient.
Damn you guys are silly stupid on this. Take the shot or face the consequence period and full stop.
Right to infect everyone? What part of ‘vaccinated can still spread covid’ do you not understand?
CNS: NBC – Vaccinated people are less likely to spread Covid, new research finds
First, the chances of you catching Covid if you are vaccinated are low, around 5% to 15% vs like 90% if unvaccinated. Next, new studies show that while the initial loads are all but identical they fall off for vaccinated rapidly.
Just go get vaxxed people so we an all get back to this new normal.
So the unvaxxed do not have the right to infect the vaxxed? Say that a few more times. Aren’t you protected if you got the vaxx? Isn’t that the reason to get vaxxed?
If the unvaccinated are doing 14 days then it can’t be them bringing it in. Lol calling it idiot logic when the only choice is Pfizer and there is plenty of evidence of adverse side effects.
Well then get your doc to bring in the vax of your choice and get vaxxed. You spew nonsense about plenty of evidence of adverse reactions from Pfizer. You’re going to have to get it at some point. Probably even to travel home unless you’re going back to the States which is where most anti-vaxxers seem to come from, but if you’re not then good luck finding a good route home without being vaxxed.
“Take the shot or face the consequence period and full stop” Sounds like a threat.
Quit pushing people who simply want to be left alone into a corner or face the inevitable backlash and full stop.
In the interest of public safety, these whack jobs should be locked up.
Ahh yes, the tolerant voice in this argument. Let’s lock up your idealogical opponents.
Hmmm, I wonder what that sounds like? Oh wait, I forgot its ‘different’ for you because ‘you’ care about other people. ‘You’ are doing this for public safety and those people, yes those people, are just evil idiots who don’t even know that they are wrong. How could they not see for the only way it is, that YOU are correct and every other stance is incorrect.
How stunning and brave for you to be advocating using the state in order to lock up those who don’t agree with you on a topic. Well done.
Hide behind the state more, sheep.
Prime political opportunism.
Of course – but at least they are doing the right thing