CBC needs invoices to clear Christmas parcels

| 12/12/2019 | 103 Comments

(CNS): With over 40% of all packages coming into the Cayman Islands without the proper documentation, customs officials are urging the public to do what they can to help get all parcels cleared in time for the holiday season. To avoid delays, Customs and Border Control said they need a supplier or sales invoice and proof of payment. Officials also said that courier system generated commercial invoices are not acceptable.

“We understand the importance of having your packages arrive in a timely manner and would like to share do’s and don’ts for easier collection,” CBC officials said in a press release.

Pointing to the ‘do’s’, officials said that as soon as a person knows they are receiving goods, they should gather the necessary documents and share them with their agent. The necessary documents include the supplier or sales invoices in PDF format.

If other documents, such as approval from the Department of Agriculture or other government departments are required to collect the package, the person should make sure they have them before the shipment arrives. If they are not sure if additional information is required, they should ask their agent or contact a CBC officer.

The CBC stressed that people should not omit or misrepresent the value of goods or assume “everyone” will know the value of a given item. Also, hand written invoices will not be accepted and people should not assume the courier is responsible for providing the proper documentation. The person receiving the goods is responsible, officials warned.

“We endeavor to continue working with couriers and customs broker agents to ensure packages are cleared in a timely manner,” said CBC Deputy Director Kevin Walton. “We need the public’s help in doing so by having ready the necessary documents, such as the supplier or sales invoice on hand.”

People bringing in packages for the first time using a courier or broker service will need to complete an Agent Authorisation form, which must be signed and dated and accompanied with a legible and valid government identification, such as a colour copy of a driver’s licence or passport picture page.

The form is available on the CBC website or from couriers or broker agents. It is important that the form is completed and provided to the courier or agent at least 48 hours before the receiver expects the package to arrive, the CBC stated.

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Comments (103)

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  1. Anonymous says:

    A brokers agent told me that the main reason for the holdup is that customs told their employees that they had to use any outstanding vacation time “use it or lose it”. So with Christmas weeks away, half the staff are on leave, Should be confirmable with a FOI request, or hopefully an Auditor General investigation, Sue, pretty please?.

    • Anonymous says:

      And it’s the same reason my trash has not been picked up this week.

    • Anonymous says:

      CAL Miami is sending invoices from ”shipping department “ instead of from the shipper you provide. All of those shipments are being booted out of the system, and going to package purgatory.

      This is a Government entity. They can not even comply with their own regulations! What a farce. Vote out anyone who approved this. Anyone that incompetent does not deserve to get one more penny from the people of Cayman. So stupid, it is beyond belief how obtuse our government is.

  2. Anonymous says:

    We need a referendum on overhauling this crazy mental system! I don’t think i have ever seen any news article on here throughout the thousands of articles, that mostly everyone is giving the thumbs up to how crazy and mental this system is and that it needs overhauling to be better and the public is tired of the stress, delays and disrespect they receive when innocently trying to clear their goods. This is not acceptable! Something needs to be done about this! It is like a third world country! #worldclass??? this is a depraved demented system! We demand change NOW!!! People please vote for politicians who actually do care about the wellbeing of the Public!!! Stop voting for the snake charmers who use your vote to to get their own benefits while abusing you!!! They are hypocrites and liars and evil doers for their own selfish gain! Vote for people who genuinely CARE about the PEOPLE!

    Mario, please run for elections! WE the PEOPLE will surely VOTE YOU IN!!! Someone who actually cares about the PEOPLE’s wellbeing!!!

    And please HELP US TO PUT TOGETHER MORE REFERENDUMS TO SORT OUT ALL THESE MESSES going on in our Country that the Powers that Be can’t be bothered to sort out! Pleeeeeease Mario, run for Elections!!!

    • Anonymous says:

      Even during wars, mail was delivered. Through centuries it was delivered on camels, sleighs, horses, etc. It was delivered without delays. If it was undeliverable, it was returned to senders, timely, everywhere in the world!

      In the US there are Mailing Standards. The United States Postal Service (USPS; also known as the Post Office, U.S. Mail, or Postal Service) is an independent agency of the executive branch of the United States federal government responsible for providing postal service in the United States, including its insular areas and associated states.
      Stealing mail is federal crime. The penalty for theft or receipt of stolen mail is imprisonment not more than 5 years or a fine or both in accordance with 18 U.S. Code § 1708. The fines can be up to $250,000. In addition, the perpetrator may be subject to state prosecution.

      WHY in the Cayman Islands Postal service is run like Mom&Pop shop? Are there Standards? Regulations?

  3. Anonymous says:

    Eliminate import duty on all consumer goods below $5k. Raise threshold to $10k in December.
    Charge a small fixed amount thereafter.
    You can easily replace import duty revenue by increasing traffic offenses fines and enforcing traffic laws. Make sure paying the fine online is a breeze.

    • Anonymous says:

      Or stop giving concessions to developers in the middle of a construction boom, and in a period of sustained economic growth while bragging about how great the economy is and start enforcing fines on traffic offenses instead of amnesty periods for people who are too lazy to follow the rules

      • BeaumontZodecloun says:

        Oh, stop it; nobody has time for your sensible ideas. 😉

      • Anonymous says:

        3:34 am
        Charge vehicle owners, who park derelict cars on private property without permission.

      • Anonymous says:

        Stopped continually giving concessions to developers and the revenue problems will be solved. Furthermore, the millions spent on administering all of this nonsense would be a massive saving.

      • Anonymous says:

        Totally not doing couriers anymore. Presently it takes a minimum of 10 days to clear a shipment. The only way to get it fast is to bring it back it person on a plane. Govt. is really shooting themselves in the foot on this one.

        Now I do not pay duty on the high shipping costs to Cayman. I saved more money than it cost to pay couriers to ship to Cayman by flying to Miami. I book a hotel, go to a nice dinner, and have a fun day at the mall, and it costs less. And government collects less. As usual, no one in government thinks through any sort of process management.

    • Anonymous says:

      Ummm, you would kill the entire retail sector of the economy….

    • Anonymous says:

      Ummm, this will not work unless you want other taxes. We just need non-moronic rules, and a sensible system designed by people with an above year two education.

  4. Anonymous says:

    When the rest of the world trying to “go green”, even retail invoices could be emailed now instead of printed, Cayman is 20 years behind in reducing its carbon footprint.
    Cost of import duty collection is most certainly nullifies the import duty revenues, at least when it comes to individuals and small businesses. One has to take time off work, drive to the post office, further congesting roads and burning fuel, stand in several lines, get stressed, get sick from too much stress etc.
    This is the receiving party cost that can be monetized. I’am not even talking what it costs to CIG to run this circus. Does anyone has brain to see that and propose to eliminate the import duty? Or at least simplify it? No duty on goods under $1,000 and a small flat fee thereafter?

    • Anonymous says:

      Sorry to say we are Third World and that is how it is done in Africa and all Third World countries.

  5. Anonymous says:

    I just try and not get anything mailed to me. When people ask I just tell them I live in a third world country and they understand.

    • Anonymous says:

      7:43, Having lost at least half a dozen mailed items from Canada in the past 2 years, I now tell everyone there that I live in a Third World country, so please don’t mail anything to me here.

  6. Anonymous says:

    They believe PDF invoices can’t be edited. 🙄

  7. Anonymous says:

    They never on time for an import or export container inspection, the show up late and a few occasions, never show up at all. They start work at 8:30am but don’t leave office until 9:30am but have to stop Tortuga or Foster’s before schedule inspection at 9:00am that why they always start inspections at 10:30 so its close to lunch time. Also, they don’t work after 4pm

  8. Anonymous says:

    12:36pm…i am a native indigenous caymanian! any more stupid comments?

  9. Anonymous says:

    Charles Clifford and Kevin Walton should be dismissed for implementing such a system.

  10. Crab Claw says:

    Oh wait, has it changed at the airport Post Office yet, the CBC officer is only in court from 11am to 2am and one of them caught some serious attitude with me once because I came a few minutes pass 2, it is back to the next day with you, lastly to myself a commercial invoice carries more detail info than a regular invoice but for some reason these wonder agents know best not to take such an item.

  11. Anonymous says:

    I use a commercial agent for 100% of my packages (I have used US Link for over 15 years, but here are others). My packages are sent to their office in Miami, and they bring it in — I usually have it 2-3 days after arrival in Miami. There is a service fee associated with it but for me worth it for the convenience and not have to spend time lining up etc. Works like clockwork for me — I have about 50 shipments a year, mainly from Amazon.

    (And it is pretty easy to “apply a slight discount” by altering the PDF invoice by a small reasonable amount……and that pays for my service fee with US Link…ha).

    • Anonymous says:

      Why not support local businesses?

      • Anonymous says:

        Because many charge ridiculous prices for the same product one can buy online including the subsequent duties for much less.

        • Anonymous says:

          I agree. I will buy local if the mark up is reasonable, but on a recent item I brought in, after I had paid shopping/taxes/agent the local price was 3 times what I paid in total. Yes, it was exactly the same item.

        • BeaumontZodecloun says:

          Agree to some extent; if I import something, convert that U.S. amount — including the shipping and duties — to C.I. and then tack on 25%, that is MORE than enough profit, yeah?

          There are some that double it or more. Not just a few either.

          • Anonymous says:

            Large galaxy bar £1 in UK (as displayed on corner of packaging). Same bar, same label of chocolate in Fosters CI$2.69 or thereabouts. And they get trade prices discounted if they buy in bulk. Go figure!

            • Anonymous says:

              Because businesses have to pay staff minimum wage, CUC and water, work permits because there isn’t enough Caymanians willing to work a minimum wage job, insurance for the company, health insurance for the staff, pension, marketing, high rental rates etc all of those factors are what adds up to the cost.

  12. Anonymous says:

    Just face it folks. We are a backwards little third world country with primitive people in charge of making government regulations that they believe will move us to the 21st century – but the problem is their brains are stuck the 18th century…
    As President Trump would say: ‘SAD’

    • Concerned says:

      Where is the phone number and email address to contact if you have questions….. I’ve been waiting 3 weeks for a reply to an urgent inquiry. Incompetence.

  13. Dan says:

    Customs are underwork and overpaid! They need to work 7 days a week as shipping arrive everyday to Cayman Islands. I had package hold by the customs for 2 weeks even I gave correct paperwork. They are running the business like in 1970’s.

    • Anonymous says:

      I actually feel really bad for the people on the front line. They are just doing their job! They do not want 10 times more work, and angry customers. The blame needs to go to those who implemented this moronic system. Let them be responsible for this mess, it is their pile of steaming dung.

  14. Anonymous says:

    So The Cayman Islands Customs Department is trusting air passengers are honest and within the legal limits for goods, but those who receive goods by mail are crooks by default whose only goal is to avoid paying the import duty.

  15. Anonymous says:

    Just another idiotic scheme implemented by the same cusoms/cdc member who has led a string of failures but continues to rise within that department.

  16. Anonymous says:

    This island couldn’t run a dog on a leash if they tried. Probably why there are so many strays… and backwards policy.

  17. Anonymous says:

    Commercial Invoices? so dumb … because once you remove the word commercial from the invoice, customs will accept it! like there was any difference on the invoice other than the word commercial? SERIOUSLY? A lot of company’s have this in place, and we need to tell them to change there system, just for us? I think CBC officers are just lazy and are looking a way not to process these and just kick back ….

  18. Anonymous says:

    This is absolutely ridiculous, not only does it hold up valuable shipments to this island for Caymanians trying to make a dollar it’s also unreasonable! The online system is not efficient and you still have to submit 40 different times before approval…. and they also keep asking for paperwork they never needed times before. Oh and don’t get me started on the fact that you have to take screenshots of your currency conversion, only from xe.com! Don’t you think a program that runs well would have that built-in? We get the invoices we get from our goods! You’re already screwing us with duty on free shipping and not fully accepting a 40% discount. What more do you people want from us? Thieves.

  19. Anonymous says:

    yet the ritz carlton fiasco walked away with 6 million in concession? yet the govt taxing the poor to pieces? the other day i had to pay 22.50 usd import duties

  20. philip says:

    whoever had this bright idea needs to step down, so the rest of the world is expected to change their invoicing system to suit our customs department, whom were clearly understaffed before they introduced this new system and are now blaming the public for the delay in clearing courier packages, which is taking 2 weeks if the invoice is not the correct one, and to roll out a new system right before christmas which is the busiest time of year for freight is absolutely insane .

  21. Anonymous says:

    How nobody comment on those leeches charging duty on non-existent shipping fees. I heard Clifford and Walton on the radio trying to justify this by saying there is “no free lunch”. What a joke. The reality is that a shipping fee if I chose to get items to me in two days will cost $20USD. If I chose to use “free shipment” method and receive the items in a week instead, CIG is saying that that shipment fee if it were to be charged would be $65KYD. Guaranteed, I will be picking up ALL of my packages in Miami.

    • Anonymous says:

      Shipping is included because some used to increase the shipping cost but drop the item price to circumvent

      Not a customs agent

      • Anonymous says:

        When you get free shipping, they invent an imaginary $65 shipping charge on top of what you paid.

        So if you pay $18 for something and $2 shipping, you are charged customs on $20.

        If you pay $20 for an item with free shipping, you get charged customs on $20 + $65.

        How did they even come up with $65. PS I am not the OP, I am someone else who experienced this.

  22. Anonymous says:

    CBC seems to have implemented new technology and processes with the objective of making things more difficult and time consuming. The individuals responsible for the new systems and processes need to be held accountable for the mess that they have created. Unfortunately there is no accountability when it comes to spending the taxpayers money and wasting the taxpayers time.

    • Anonymous says:

      My post office package advice was dated October but only made it to my GT post box this week. When I went to pick it up & pointed out the date the moron said ‘that’s alright’. I said it’s not alright to take 6 weeks to send an advice from the airport to GT. Was then told they have system problems. No apology!!
      Like others, I’ve told people never to send gifts here but this was something I ordered. Shame I needed it in October – for Halloween.

      • Anonymous says:

        i got a form today for a parcel delived to island in May, i have already recieved a refund for a “lost” parcel

      • Mickey Mouse says:

        8.07am Have you forgotten the saga not long ago when everyone’s parcel notice went missing and the lady manager at the APO had to apologise as when they were photocopied the wrong person picked them up and they got lost. It sounds like they have learned nothing and this problem still exists.

    • Anonymous says:

      By complicating things job security is guaranteed.

  23. Cheese Face says:

    The Gov should actually be taken to court over this. On a regular basis, critical parts are held up because some numpty doesn’t like the invoice. Companies are losing money you F******g morons!

    • Anonymous says:

      And anyone bringing such a court action would almost certainly win, hands down. There is no way their conduct on much of this stuff is rational, reasonable or proportionate as required by the constitution.

      • Anonymous says:

        And yet they willingly and knowingly act in breach of the constitution. No accountability. Ever.

    • Blue Dream says:

      I did a RATA (Registration of Articles Taken Abroad) form for government-owned and duty exempt instruments to be sent abroad for repairs. Took two days to ship back here. Two weeks later, no instruments. Why?

      They didn’t want the RATA form with the serial numbers and official customs stamp. They wanted a letter containing only MY signature and an invoice that I created. Does my signature override their stamp????

      I na hear so much BS. It’s like their purpose is to create additional paperwork.

      • Anonymous says:

        The negligence levels can be criminal. They can constitute malfeasance in public office. Someone should prosecute, privately if necessary.

      • Anonymous says:

        One can argue that the invoice is to charge duty on the value of repairs, but if you’re a government entity you should be duty exempt regardless so no reason why the RATA form shouldn’t have been accepted.

        Pile of foolishness

  24. Anonymous says:

    The results you get when the inmates run the asylum.

  25. Anonymous says:

    One would think that in a territory that phrases itself as a world’s financial center the postal service would be exemplary.
    CBC starts on an assumption that people are crooks intentionally trying to “ misrepresent and omit the value of goods “. “The person receiving the goods” is guilty by default.
    So forget grandmas homemade cookies from Latvia. She will need to include a printed invoice in PDF format, list all ingredients used and receipts confirming its cost; but first, call her to inquire if she sent you something for Christmas, no surprises allowed.

  26. Anonymous says:

    I just ordered a car part from the U.S. last week and paid for next day delivery by Fed Ex. It arrived on Monday and today is Friday and its still at Customs awaiting clearance approval. I did provide the invoice and other documentation to the courier before it arrived.
    This is what we get when we have customer unfriendly government regulations.

    • Anonymous says:

      I’m with you. I ordered some goods for my business. Paid for a speedy FedEx delivery and then had to wait 3 more days after they arrived for the goods to clear. Makes it pointless – especially when you are charged duty on the fact that you have tried to receive the goods promptly.

  27. Anonymous says:

    The sensible thing is to stop charging duty entirely on everything but fuel, and drop it 50% on fuel. Just let the people bring in anything they want. You already let the developers and the duty free stores do this, so you don’t lose much. Stop screwing around. The mail and the parcel service would zoom through and everyone would be happy. The postal workers could go work for Carnival or sit at home like they do now.

  28. Anonymous says:

    In the US I order random crap from somewhere in China on Amazon and it usually gets to my house in a week or 10 days tops. It’s amazing. Cayman is not amazing in this regard. I may as well be ordering from Botswana via the moon. You should close your post office and go private. Those first class airmail letters never arrive anyway so what’s to lose?

    • Anonymous says:

      This is the second post to cite Botswana as an extreme. Having lived in Botswana I can tell you that their postal service doesn’t takes weeks to clear a parcel, nor do you have to provide a felled trees worth of paper to collect it. Shipper declares the value for customs purposes, and the customs department only asks for supporting documents if they think that value is clearly wrong.

      • Anonymous says:

        What can be more simple than to send and receive a package by mail in 21st century? I regularly order medicine from Singapore for my mom who lives in a Baltic sea country, it takes 7-10 days to get it delivered to her door. No expedited service, just regular mail.

        Even when mail was delivered on donkeys, sleighs, or camels, in 18-19th centuries, it was done faster than it is in 2019 in Cayman.

        10:28 am you’ve rightfully reminded about “felled trees”. Thank you.

        Just eliminate import duty for individuals and small businesses. Problem solved.

  29. Anonymous says:

    This new customs scheme is so ridiculously detrimental to Cayman that anyone, who even tangentially , supported it needs to be removed from office.

  30. Anonymous says:

    I would love to know if our Government had any correspondence with Dart regarding the customs rule changes. If they notified some players, but neglected their own people they should be shamed.

    They seem to have plenty of money for their Jamaican voiced “vote yes yes yes” pro port ads on the radio. But apparently no money to notify actual Caymanian businesses that they are going to try and ruin our businesses with foolish new requirements.

  31. Anonymous says:

    I don’t get why I have to go through 3 or 4 different queues to get my parcel. It’s so backwards the way they operate there its mind boggling.

  32. Anonymous says:

    Most anti-Caymanian government ever. No thought for even one minute for the people of This Island. Hope they are all voted out.

  33. Anonymous says:


  34. Anonymous says:

    Referendum to overhaul they system. It’s ridiculous. I’ve instructed my family not to send anything because of the chaotic, stupid, retarded system designed by someone that failed to graduate beyond their third grade

    • Anonymous says:

      Me too. Makes for a pretty grim Christmas!

    • Anonymous says:

      So did I. Mr. Clifford is fully aware of how badly the Customs dept is operating but nothing is being done. They are so inefficient that you wonder if they are just being perverse. No department can be this bad. Dear Ombudsman please examine this department for maladministration.

      • Anonymous says:

        I am sure the Ombudsman will be right on it, right after the Department of Education, the Police, OfReg, WORC, Planning, Environmental Health, the Elections Office, Healthcare, Roads Authority, etc. investigations are completed.

  35. Anonymous says:

    I had to redirect all of my shipments to Miami, and book a flight and go pick them up in person, because of this. It takes weeks to get shipments cleared. Our Government never thinks things through. They just do silly changes, and let small businesses pay the price for their stupidity. I truly wish they had to earn their keep, it might be different if they had to actually work for their pay.

    • Anonymous says:

      The government is supposed to exist to serve the public. These jerks have the attitude that the public is here to serve them. They’re civil service jobs wouldn’t exist if it weren’t for the private sector whom they so little regard.

    • Anonymous says:

      Many people are flying up to get their shipments. There is no other option if you need items in a timely fashion.

      I do feel bad for the Customs staff ; it is not there fault that some idiot bigwigs put these rules in place. Please remember to be kind to them, they just work there.

    • Anonymous says:

      where do you get them redirected to?

  36. Anonymous says:

    This article should read ‘CBC needs DIFFERENT invoices from whatever you have to clear shipments’. Because whatever you have is wrong, unacceptable, and possibly containing the Ebola virus.

    • BeaumontZodecloun says:

      Perfectly said.

      It also would have been special for us to have been apprised of the specifics of the new “system” prior to having all our packages waylaid, or mislaid or whatever dark corner they were tossed in.

      Most of us are very well trained; just tell us what you WANT! We will do it.

      Really don’t understand why the invoice as sent by the supplier is not sufficient; the necessary information is tracking number, cost (including shipping), and detail of the item(s) ordered.

    • Anonymous says:

      @7:52 – OMG I thought it was just me going through this!!!! Seriously, it’s ridiculous. I’ve printed invoices that show price of each item, total, taxes paid, delivery and form of payment……sometimes they’ll accept that, sometimes they want the confirmation email. You never know from one delivery to the other. But it’s never the documents the that I have.

  37. Anonymous says:

    I send purchased items via FedEx from the states and they arrive in two days. I provide the required invoices in advance and it still takes four days to get from the airport to SMB. How is that system working for you citizens.

  38. Anonymous says:

    When “over 40% of all packages coming into the Cayman Islands without the proper documentation” SOMETHING IS SERIOUSLY WRONG with the mail system.

    Don’t blame recipients. It is 100% CIG fault.

    CHANGE the system so even a 1st grader in Botswana or Afghanistan would understand what he needs to do to send a parcel to the Cayman Islands. Everywhere else in the world sending and receiving a package is not a rocket science. Only in Cayman it is complicated for no reason at all.

    • Anonymous says:

      And your very foolish if you believe this load of shit they trying sell the public. The couriers and brokers bin in business years they know the requirements. How about they address the limited staff compliment and long wait times. Most brokers and couriers upload paper work before the shipment arrives and it’s takes CBC 1 week sometimes to clear the shipment. Come one the Island is 97% reliant on imports and every year its the same thing around this time. Come on Kevin Walton WE AINT STUPID OUT HERE!


    • Anonymous says:

      Okay, I see your point, but if you are buying online or from Amazon, or Old Navy, or whatever, Cayman is an insignificant market segment. To expect Jeff Bezos to change all of Amazons invoicing practices for our moronic government is not reasonable.

  39. Anonymous says:

    Crazy stupid customs rules. No one thinks anything through before they foist foolishness on the small businesses, and locals. It takes weeks to get shipments cleared that used to take hours.
    i.e. You can no longer submit a ‘Commercial Invoice’. You have to go back to your supplier and have them remove the word ‘Commercial’. Okay, that is a complete waste of time and idiotic beyond belief. On the radio talk show it was explained that it is because many false invoices from China were ‘Commercial Invoices’ and so they are no longer acceptable. By this logic, if many false invoices contained the number ‘5’, all invoices that contain the number ‘5’ should similarly be rejected. Don’t even get me started on the having to redo the same paperwork over, and over, and over again for each shipping agent. Or the COLS dropping after filling out 6 pages, or the no customer service on Saturday policy.

    • Elvis says:

      I gave up expecting uk mail , gifts and xmas cards long ago , I just old my family t o text m as it seems too difficult to receive a card without some kind of idiot taxation or dirty look at the post office , someone somewhere has all my cds too by the way.

    • Anonymous says:

      Or no one to answer the cols support line or a supervisor who doesn’t have an attitude when you ask a simple question. And I won’t even start on the fact that we’re doing majority of the work now and an entry gets assigned for three days to an officer who isn’t even at work. And don’t bother asking for the overall manager that damn hog just needs a farm and a sty.

  40. Anonymous says:

    What a stupid system.

    • Anonymous says:

      another hot mess.

    • AKA demic says:

      Cos it’s run by stupid people.

      • Anonymous says:

        They just stand there while you try to tell them how serious this is, when you pause for their response they create that dazed look and come up with mumbo jumbo that does not make a lick of sense. Remember some years ago at the P.O. they created this KY sorting system that was suppose to help them “not to “put mail in the incorrect box. That filing system has gotten so bad that they had to allocate a separate bin to throw the return mail into. I had an issue at the P.o., some months ago. I went inside and drop my mail in the slot, it sounded different from other times when it dropped. I waited to see a friendly face and saw someone coming towards the area with a bin, I look through the slot and saw her placed it under the slot for foreign mail where I dropped my mail. I called to her and told her that I had just dropped a piece of mail there so if she could check under the bin and get it for me. She gave me a ” how dare you stare- down and I stared back, she took her time, waddled back and came with the letter- asked me – this wah you waan- I said yes thank you and got the stare-down again.

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