Gender minister won’t back gay marriage

| 04/09/2015 | 260 Comments
Cayman News Service

Tara Rivers, Minister of Education, Employment and Gender Affairs

(CNS): In her first public comment regarding the issue of gay marriage, the employment and education minister has stated that she believes marriage should be defined to be between a man and a woman. Just ahead of revelations this week that a gay couple will be seeking to have their legitimate marriage recognized by the immigration authorities, Tara Rivers fell far short of condemning Anthony Eden’s recent comments in the Legislative Assembly, stating that people are free to share or not their opinions. She said she did not “condone violence of any kind, or discrimination in the workplace or otherwise”.

Rivers voted in favour of Eden’s recent private member’s motion to define marriage as between a man and a woman.

In the draft labour legislation currently under discussion, which is based on law that passed in 2004 but never enacted, gender orientation is included in the list of things that will become an offence for employers to discriminate against.

However, as well as being responsible for labour issues and education, Rivers is also the minister responsible for gender affairs, which in the modern context extends far beyond women’s rights and generally includes issues impacting the lesbian, gay, bisexual, and transgender (LGBT) community.

Explaining her views on marriage, the minister said in a brief statement to CNS in response to questions posed earlier this week, “Our Constitution recognises marriage to be between a man and a woman. It also recognises our freedom of thought, religion and expression. We are free to share, or not share, publicly our opinions, beliefs and values. However, with freedom comes responsibility – to one another and to society at large. As a Christian, I believe that marriage should be defined to be between a man and a woman. I also believe that we should love one another as Christ loves us. As such, I do not condone violence of any kind, or discrimination in the workplace or otherwise.”

Rivers was not asked at the time about the situation facing Dr Leonardo Raznovich and his husband, but regardless of her position the Human Rights Commission has already informed the government that it needs to legalise same sex unions before the country finds itself in breach of the European Convention on Human Rights and its own constitution, which may lead to costly lawsuits.

So far, Wayne Panton remains the only Cabinet member in favour of introducing the necessary legislation for same-sex unions immediately and addressing the extension of all human rights to members of the LGBT community.

The chair of the Human Rights Commission, James Austin-Smith, has confirmed that he has received an acknowledgement from government regarding his letter and the need for legislation to deal with same sex-unions and has also confirmed that the HRC will be looking at the issues raised regarding Raznovich and his husband.

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Category: Government oversight, Laws, Politics

Comments (260)

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  1. Anonymous says:

    Let me state this again. Religion holds no place in politics. This includes Christianity.

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    • Anonymous says:

      Everyone’s politics is shaped by their values. You don’t get to silence people because you don’t share their views.

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    • Unison says:

      Don’t get to fanatical on the premise of the separation of Church & State. Yes, no government should make laws respecting a religion or infringing the rights of another so long there is no harm done.

      However that does not mean Christians must stay mute and allow government to make laws against good morals. They have a voice and can become politically active. The Pope has encourage all Christians to speak out and ensure legislation on the side of faith and morals. What’s wrong with that?

    • Anonymous says:

      Society’s are always influenced by Religion. Take the Middle East.Even the more moderate countries are guided by Islamic views. Western society is based at the minimum of Christianity. It is only the disease we have labelled tolerance that we are amending laws to bend to what is deemed politically correct. Just as we have seen a view cases of domestic violence swept under the rug so that certain figures can not have their reputation tarnished and look PC. It is not right. Now we want to allow a perverted version of marriage to be accepted as normal and lawfull in name of being PC. This is not right. I am not advocating any type of unlawfull actions against these people. We are all Gods children. But being gay is one thing , parading it around and slapping it in the face of the union of marriage is another. This is not a healthy example to show our children. Not is the disgusting abuse of women, the adultry that goes on either here, but do not add another element of instability to an already troubled equation because the former exisists, or in the name of being PC. Stand erect people and do not allow your hard stance to be silenced by a small group of people that only want to engage in deviant acts. It is just like the pro ganja supporters. ” We are for medicinal purpose” except they are not the ones that are sick and are recreational users but are all for it in the name of medicine.

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  2. Anonymous says:

    Its ironic really that Ms Rivers gets virtually no support for either or education or labor laws/edicts but she spouts bigotry and suddenly she gets supporters. Wow!

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    • Anonymous says:

      I do not find that amazing at all.

    • Anonymous says:

      So expressing your conviction that marriage should be between a man and woman is “spouting bigotry”? As someone who is clearly intolerant of the opinions of others you are clearly the bigot. Try not to use words unless you understand their meaning.

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      • Emily says:

        These people wants to observe the biblical guideline on marriage but they are so blind with hatred that they are all missing the big picture here:

        There are several epistles written by the apostle Paul that refer to marriage and how believers are to operate within the marriage relationship. One such passage is 1 Corinthians chapter 7, and another is Ephesians 5:22-33. When studied together, these two passages provide biblical principles that form a framework for a God-pleasing marriage relationship.

        When a believing husband and wife institute God’s principles, a biblical marriage results. A biblically based marriage is one that is in balance, with Christ as the head of the man and the wife together. The biblical concept of marriage is a oneness between two individuals that pictures the oneness of Christ with His church.

        So let me ask now, should a marriage between two unbelievers be accepted?

        Stop hating people…and Tara, focus on what you were elected to do, you have failed us and our children. You are a disgrace to our Islands and under your watch the Education system is crashing!

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  3. Cleto C. Bodden says:

    This goes to all that are debating this issue, but instead of saying this or that, I rather give you all here, what my GOD whom I am a servant has to say to you all and if you still say that it does not matter, then read and if you still want to change the laws that HE has given below, so then go to the last bible verse that I give to you here and this is my point:

    I Corinthians 6 1-11

    1 If any of you has a dispute with another, dare he take it before the ungodly for judgment instead of before the saints?
    2 Do you not know that the saints will judge the world? And if you are to judge the world, are you not competent to judge trivial cases?
    3 Do you not know that we will judge angels? How much more the things of this life! 4 Therefore, if you have disputes about such matters, appoint as judges even men of little account in the church!
    5 I say this to shame you. Is it possible that there is nobody among you wise enough to judge a dispute between believers?
    6 But instead, one brother goes to law against another–and this in front of unbelievers!
    7 The very fact that you have lawsuits among you means you have been completely defeated already. Why not rather be wronged? Why not rather be cheated?
    8 Instead, you yourselves cheat and do wrong, and you do this to your brothers.
    9 Do you not know that the wicked will not inherit the kingdom of God? Do not be deceived: Neither the sexually immoral nor idolaters nor adulterers nor male prostitutes nor homosexual offenders
    10 nor thieves nor the greedy nor drunkards nor slanderers nor swindlers will inherit the kingdom of God.
    11 And that is what some of you were. But you were washed, you were sanctified, you were justified in the name of the Lord Jesus Christ and by the Spirit of our God.

    Also read: Leviticus 18:22
    22 You shall not lie with a male as with a woman. It is an abomination.

    If you want to add or remove what GOD said on the bible with all of the above, then take some time to read and see where do you fit on this last bible verse, are you going to be in favor or against this issue, after GOD Himself declared that it is an abomination, so here goes for you if you vote in favor of homosexuals:

    Revelation 22

    18 I warn everyone who hears the words of the prophecy of this scroll: If anyone adds anything to them, God will add to that person the plagues described in this scroll. 19 And if anyone takes words away from this scroll of prophecy, God will take away from that person any share in the tree of life and in the Holy City, which are described in this scroll.

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    • Anonymous says:

      I like Leviticus, it has some passages we need to enshrine into our Constitution.

      Leviticus 19:20-22: “And whosoever lieth carnally with a woman, that is a bondmaid, betrothed to an husband, and not at all redeemed, nor freedom given her; she shall be scourged; they shall not be put to death, because she was not free. And he shall bring his trespass offering unto the LORD, unto the door of the tabernacle of the congregation, even a ram for a trespass offering. And the priest shall make an atonement for him with the ram of the trespass offering before the LORD for his sin which he hath done: and the sin which he hath done shall be forgiven him.”

      I believe today’s equivalent would be to take a plate of curry goat or oxtail to someone on the church council as atonement for raping your helper. And while on the subject of helpers, here are some other good verses from the source from which you made your judgment.

      Leviticus 25:44-46: “Your male and female slaves are to come from the nations around you; from them you may buy slaves. You may also buy some of the temporary residents living among you and members of their clans born in your country, and they will become your property. You can will them to your children as inherited property and can make them slaves for life, but you must not rule over your fellow Israelites ruthlessly.”

      It seems like we have sinned by bringing people from the Philippines. Quite clearly the Bible tells us that we can only have slaves from Jamaica, Cuba, and Honduras.

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    • Anonymous says:

      I thought Jesus deleted Leviticus. Is it back in? Darn it, I like my lobster and conch, but the prospect of stoning family members might make up for it.

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    • Anonymous says:

      Great. That would convince me if I knew it was what god said. Explain how you know this is what god said.

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    • Anonymous says:

      There we go, threats from the bible bashers. I do not believe for one minute that our Good Lord intended anyone to use his name to threaten people. Just as a short reminder, people (men) wrote the book, not God.

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      • Anonymous says:

        There in lies a frightening, age-old problem… if the BIBLE is not to be trusted as the authority of what is on God’s mind and his desires for how we are to live … then WHO or WHAT is… last time someone heard God’s voice, it commanded her to drown her children in a bathtub.

    • Anonymous says:

      re: the Corinthians 1-7 part: I have no idea what that means, what with all the double negatives and all. Although I mean well, does my poor grasp on medieval English doom me to being unwashed and my brothers too? That doesn’t seem fair to my brothers.

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      • Anonymous says:

        I now know that I am not going to inherit the Kingdom of God for lots and lots of reasons, so I might as well have lots more fun before Judgment Day.

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    • Anonymous says:

      Sorry God did not write the bible.

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  4. Anonymous says:

    7 am…..you are so right. Europe is in tatters. They are all liberals and stick to no code.
    They will be overrun by another religion and you know what I mean. Good luck with rights for women , gays or any other freedom!!

    • Anonymous says:

      You can say “muslim”. Don’t worry we all know what racist point you were making.

    • Anonymous says:

      I am a European living in Cayman and I can tell you that my moral compass is very different to the dominant one I see here of greed, corruption, discrimination, bullying, divorce, child abuse, domestic violence, absent fathers etc. As the bible says “do not judge lest you be judged”.

      • Be Real says:

        Hey, Cochise, here’s a new idea. Go back to your Eruopean Country. You can enjoy your liberalization there. Nobody begged you to come here. In fact I bet if a vote was done, nobody would want you here. So go back to your war torn, liberalized, barbaric country.

        Of all the items you listed you forgot to mention that the European nations have one of the highest rates of these crimes. The only difference is that here these crimes are brought to light and not shoved under the rug.

        I’ve been to several other Eruopean countries and I can say first hand, not one of these countries had anything to offer but hardship and corruption and most of the time war. Before you start telling me how to live in my country, maybe you should live in yours and tell them how to run it. Or maybe your one of those criminals that got ran out.

        Besides,if this country is soooo bad, then why are you still here. Just leave.

        • Anonymous says:

          You forgot to mention there are many plans leaving daily. That is kind of obligatory on this sort of rant.

        • Anonymous says:

          In fact I was invited here for my expertise so in fact I am here by invitation. But no worries I am exiting very soon to another territory that actually wants to change and recognizes expertise.

      • Anonymous says:

        You forgot incest.

    • Anonymous says:

      Lutherans?

  5. Jon Ebanks says:

    while we are legalizing gay marriage. let us legalize abortion. marijuana weed. gambling. prostitution (after all ppl should have the right to sell and buy what they please, especially their own bodies. Government has no right to tell us we cant sell our bodies!) let Sundays be business as usual. let’s keep the bars and drinking on till 6am the next morning. don’t stop at gay marriage legalize everything that has made the rest of the world immoral!

    • Cayman Bobo says:

      Hey what’s good for our exalted elected class should be good enough for the rest of us!

    • Anonymous says:

      Jon I call that a good start!!

    • Anonymous says:

      Ok! Let’s do it!

    • Rp says:

      There is a big difference here buddy! Being gay is not a choice. Gambling, weed, prostitution are choices.

      I am straight male, married with a child. I was born being physically attracted to women, I did not choose that. Gay people are born being attracted to their own sex, they do not choose to be gay.

      So I am lucky to be born in a way that society accepts. But what if I was born gay? Why should I be treated differently? That’s what I asked myself and then I understand the injustice.

      • Anonymous says:

        You are making a false equation between heterosexuality and sexual deviance. Many gay people acknowledge that it is a choice. There is no gay gene.

      • Unison says:

        Born or not born, the Church has ever taught, WE ARE BORN SINNERS and that includes everyone. We have the desire in us to constantly be a selfish and sinful person. So we are in need of a higher power, Grace to save us.

        Hence we may say being a sinner by nature is not a choice; however we can not say that doing the ACT of sin has nothing to do with choice. Just like we can not say a person born gay excuses him or her from having the choice to do the ACT.

        So the Church teach that it is not the feeling or the temptations of sin in us that’s sin. But again, rather it is the sinful ACT that can never be divorced from choice that will see us to hell unless we receive God’s grace.

        Peace 🙂

    • Anonymous says:

      By doing nothing about the child abuse cases that come to light, you have by proxy legalized incest.

  6. Anonymous says:

    What other ideology in the world could possibly support the video’s shown regarding Planned Parenthood XXXXXXXX

    CNS: How Planned Parenthood hoax avoids the truth

  7. Anonymous says:

    Looks like minister Rivers is finding out about how liberalism begun infesting the country… like it has in Europe and now the states… And it always come in the form of human rights, education, tolerance etc. when the reality is liberalism tolerates nothing but liberalism irrespective of the origin of the country or its people’s founding beliefs or principles. Liberalism infects and destroys everything in its path.

  8. check it out says:

    Well. I for one am concerned.

    Since we are going to have to do this then lets get ready to rumble.
    Theres a guy that said he was going to obtain a license for his marriage to three women. He will have to be granted it.Its their human right as consenting adults. And cannot be denied it.

    You can not now choose which laws are convienant and which are not. You either do it or dont. All of it.

    While your at it it is also offensive to have a national song that says “God save the Queen”.

    Its offensive to have graveyards with headstones that have religious symbols and words.

    Since religion is not important then some of the laws that were based on religion are not important. To those that say laws were not based on religion i say you have no idea what your talking about. Documented history proves it. Its called morals for those who dont have any.

    Like thou shall not kill. Murder. I can take out someone who pisses me off.
    Adultery. Sleep with anyone i want, when i want.
    Thou shall not steal. Theft, Burglary etc…. i can take what i want, when i want.

    Guess we dont need these anymore. I tell you what. The world will be a better place without a lot of unessecary people in it. Survival of the fittest?

    Remember. You started it. We’ll finish it. You want liberalism. You got it. If you start denying these things then your no better than the Nazi’s, Racists etc…..

    What i will remind you of is the fact that this country was founded and governed under principles of religion. For those in this society who dont like it. Move away. Go somewhere where the majority share your beliefs. Go where your beliefs are accepted and laws were put in place which protect you. Do not expect me to accept or change my ways to suit you when you are not willing to change yours to suit me.

    These things were put into place before we all lived, by the forefathers. They were put into law. The least that must be done is a referendum and vote. Locally.
    If you dont like the results then go somewhere where you do. The world will go on without you being here. The island will continue.

    Go in peace. But also leave me in peace.

    • Anonymous says:

      There are many religions, but this country was founded on Christianity, but being a Christian is not a requirement of a persons domicile here and at this very moment, we live among many people who are not Christians.

      No one is asking you to do anything and like all the other non-Christians already living here they have not made any change in our believe in Christianity. I fail to see how acts like theft and murder which affects other people is equal to gay marriage which affects no one.

      Christian or not, we gave special privileges to a “spouse” by law. Some people want these special privileges for the person that they love who happens to be of the same gender. The issue is about love by law, not sex, and these islands can use all the love that it can get.

      I could not say express this idea better the the US Justice Kennedy:

      No union is more profound than marriage, for it embodies the highest ideals of love, fidelity, devotion, sacrifice, and family. In forming a marital union, two people become something greater than once they were. As some of the petitioners in these cases demonstrate, marriage embodies a love that may endure even past death. It would misunderstand these men and women to say they disrespect the idea of marriage. Their plea is that they do respect it, respect it so deeply that they seek to find its fulfillment for themselves.

      • Johnny Says says:

        Hey, here’s a genuine idea.

        First you say that there are persons here who do not believe in Christianity. Okay. Agreed.
        Let’s get rid of the CHRISTmas, Easter holidays.
        Next, why marriage. This is a religious based act. Just call them civil unions done in court. You quoted Kennedy, Unions.
        Next comes funerals, again religious based ideas. Just burn em and spread em, dead bodies take up good space anyways.

        But wait, are these non Christians domiciled here, originally from here, or do they hold another passport, citizenship. If they do, what has occurred in there birth country. Why not go back there. I didn’t leave my country and demand change to suit me. The nazis did that remember.

        You can not be liberal for some things that suit you and not liberal for others that don’t suit you. You have to go all in or not at all. You cuss Mr. Eden, I don’t, I don’t agree with everything he said, but at least I know where he stands. Most of these so called liberals are only looking out for the payout and as that payout changes so do their beliefs. He took a stand and stands his ground.

        But what I believe in most is the power of the local people, you say people want change, okay. Then have a local vote., referendum. It’s that simple. If everyone is as liberal as you claim then it should be no problem. Don’t be a coward and make claims if you are not willing to put it to the test. Do not try to force your opinion and change something that has worked for centuries just fine for the majority.

        Like the previous person said, no one is advocating for killing people, but don’t expect change to only be for what you want. It must suit the local populations will. It must be the majority.

        And yeh you are asking me to do something. You are asking me to accept something in law that has never been a part of the laws of my country. You are asking me to accept the beliefs of a few over what I was born and raised with and what the country decided. Why not accept the beliefs of Nazis, White Surpremists, Black Panthers, Naturists, Bigamists, Prostitutes. If this small section of the society, the LGBT, expects change then they have to accept change across the board for all persons, all opinions and all beliefs, no matter what they are.

        No one is holding a gun to your head and saying you must stay here and accept our laws. Anyone can leave when they’re ready. Just don’t come here telling everyone that they’re wrong and must change. The Spainards did that to the indeginous people of South and Central Americas. Don’t expect change to only suit you, it must be across the board.

        Like I said, put it to a local vote, that’s fair. Stop trying to use what someone put into their law, thousands of miles away, to try and bully someone into what you believe. If not then you must expect the same in return and cannot expect to stop it.

      • Anonymous says:

        It may have been founded on Christian beliefs but I see little of it in practice. Did your God not say “love one another”. What I see is distrust, greed, corruption by the middle classes and upper echelons of society and a growing underclass that are disenfranchised. You reap what you sow!

  9. Anonymous says:

    Please read 2 Timothy Ch. 3 of the Bible. There are more warnings in the Bible too. Minister Rivers as a good states woman you did the right thing and all the others who are witholding the laws of these Islands, as these Islands laws we created on our Bibical Beliefs. Keep it that way, don’t change because someone says so. They tried to change Americas Constitution too, they have not yet suceeded.
    We Need to HOLD OUR GROUND and protect these Islands.

  10. good grief says:

    The word bigot is defined as; “In British English it refers to a state of mind where a person is obstinately, irrationally, or unfairly intolerant of ideas, opinions, or beliefs that differ from their own.” and “In American English, the term can be used similarly; however it can also be used to refer to intolerance towards a group of people in general based upon their group characteristics such as race, religion, national origin, gender, gender identity, disability, sexual orientation and socioeconomic status.” Long before this issue was promulgated into the foreground of national discussion, pushing aside issues of far greater importance and consequence for the country as a whole, everyday on CNS we could be guaranteed to see the evidence of a vitriolic hatred of the Cayman Islands and her people, their most common belief system, the constant and consistent belittling of Christianity in general and an all out assault on the human rights of Caymanians to exist in their own country. This has been done largely at the hands of those who come here and wish to force their ways upon all in the most vile, bigoted, uncaring, unfair, disrespectful, derogatory, disgusting, domineering, deflective, vindictive and wholly disingenuous way. In many ways the “Christian establishment” do not have a leg to stand on because of their collectively cowardly silence at the time of the most reprehensible prostitution of Christianity the islands have ever seen at the hands of the previous government administration, the ability to ignore the implications and consequence on a worldwide scale of what the Cayman Islands has allowed to flow through and be given domicile from a richly deserved justice in terms of the financial industry and their protection of international criminal syndicates, murderous and fraudulent dictatorial regimes, Ponzi schemers, vulture capitalists and so on and so forth. The destruction of the social fabric and family unit is and has been painfully obvious and is indicative of where the Cayman Islands have suffered immensely for collectively allowing what has been done to be done. It is not only Christianity, as a religion, that specifically denotes marriage as being solely between a man and a woman. Marriage itself is a concept which originates out of these belief systems, so why is it that those who denounce, decry, insult, and reject said belief systems wish to have their relationships sanctified by them in the first place. Those who are gay deserve human rights like everyone else, but gay people throw away the whole concept by being gay in the first place. Those who are gay should be given the credence of an institutionally accepted civil union whereupon they are given their rights as a joining of two people into a committed relationship if they so choose but it cannot be marriage in the biblical sense as it is contrary to the whole concept in its entirety. What will be will be, and the law itself may be twisted and contorted to suit whoever has enough money to throw at the issue/s at hand but one thing is for sure and that is that the pro gay lobby constantly and consistently show just as much if not much more bigotry, intolerance, hypocrisy, hatred and destructive influence than any and all of the most common belief systems when they have been manipulated for political expediency at the hands of greed induced and power hungry scumbags. The greatest injustice is that the real predators amongst us who were recently beginning to be at least minimally exposed for their misdeeds have been allowed to hide behind the shadow that this issue has cast, not unlike the writing of the constitution itself when the same thing happened. I have far more to be concerned with than gay people et al and whether he knew it or not Mr. Eden should have let sleeping dogs lay. All this has achieved is to allow the more important issues to be ignored and the perpetrators of injustice to escape responsibility. Is this whole thing just another red herring? I would not be surprised if it proves to be just that.

    • Anonymous says:

      This ought to be framed.
      – Who

      • Anonymous says:

        So true Who…. and agree with the writer, especially on the point that the gay community will be contradicting their views on wanting a marriage based on biblical definition. I do have respect for persons’ right to chose partners but why can’t a civil union be sufficient?

        Why do they need to redefine marriage which originated from religious beliefs?

        Caymanians seeking work have been told to go where they can find work, at this point I think the LGBT community or others claiming unfair discrimination should do the same…… go to countries where it is accepted, legal and you can be married to person of same sex. If Caymanians have to leave for jobs, why should foreigners come HERE for work and then expect the laws to be changed for them.

        As a BOTC you have the option to go to the Motherland get your civil union and live there. Peace

    • Diogenes says:

      I particularly liked “Those who are gay deserve human rights like everyone else, but gay people throw away the whole concept by being gay in the first place.” Perhaps you should reread your definitions of bigotry. You have some good points to make, but I am afraid when they are trailed by rampant bigotry the good points rather get lost.

      • good freakin grief says:

        I apologize for the confusion Diogenes (Greek philosopher, the most noted of the Cynics, he emphasized the need for self sufficiency and the need for natural, uninhibited behavior regardless of social conventions). What I should have written is that by being gay one throws away the concept of marriage in the first place. These definitions are not mine but of the somewhat universally accepted dictionary. I think that all human beings are inherently prejudiced one way or another due to their individual perspectives. What I am saying is that if one has a lifestyle that does not coincide with a philosophy, belief system, religion etc. then why would one wish to have oneself sanctified by it. My understanding is that we all have our own minds and perspectives and free will. I see hypocrisy everywhere, on both sides of the fence of these ideological divides. I think that Dr. Martin Luther King’s initial and uninhibited reaction to an attempt to correlate the rights of a homosexual couple to marry each other to the struggle of people of colour in the civil rights movement would have quite possibly resulted in said individual/s being coldcocked by Dr. King. He would not have done so though, due to his belief system as a Christian and as a pacifist but if he ascribed to the philosophy which you ascribe to as your moniker on CNS suggests then God only knows how he would have reacted. Mr. Eden’s somewhat tangential diatribe in the LA attempted to speak to the slippery slope of morality and the lack thereof etc. which then resulted in him making comments regarding his extreme disdain of abortion which was then quite easily taken out of context by the pro gay lobby in order to ridicule him. Sometimes I think that anarchy would be a better way to go when I see the insipid and far too often accepted institutionalized corruption which Cayman has been denigrated and inextricably damaged from and by, and if you wish for anarchy also I can tell you that the pro gay lobby would find it very hard to continue to exist at all in that scenario. This is because a natural byproduct of anarchy is violence, the animalistic system of kill or be killed. Christianity has been maligned by those who have manipulated it for their own unrighteous purposes and that is a simple truth, yet the truth which lays within Christianity is of great and beautiful value and I see it as the best way. I am not trying to get anyone else to believe what I do yet the pro gay lobby wishes to foist their ways upon one and all and take a concept which is by definition outside of the scope of said belief system. The pro gay lobby are definitely bullies and bigoted and seek to destroy anyone who does not agree with them, destroy their livelihoods, vilify and ridicule them. It is the very same intolerance of others perspectives which defines bigotry. Take it as you wish, but homosexuals do not have the right to marriage in any realm of common sense or cognizant reality. Marriage is between a man and a woman.

    • Anonymous says:

      Sounds like Minister Rivers wrote your ramblings. I guess brevity is not your strong point.

      • Rambler says:

        Minister Rivers and I have precious little in common, and I am sorry for you that your attention span is so limited. It is a somewhat complicated subject however I digress, would not want to make you think now would I? Excuse me as I ramble on. Shalom.

    • QWERTYUIOP says:

      Not terribly sure what you are telling me, but at the very least I think you are making a cry for help that the Enter key is broken on your laptop.

      • ciao says:

        Thank you for your concern regarding the functionality of my laptop. There are none so deaf as those refuse to hear and there are none so blind as those who refuse to see.

        • Anonymous says:

          Actually you have just summed up the closed minded attitude of hard line Christians who seek to impose their subjective moral code on others.

  11. Anonymous says:

    Not surprised by Minister Rivers. She’s about getting back in as an MLA (like most others).
    Minister Panton is showing the most leadership here as he is representing ALL persons human rights.

  12. Anonymous says:

    I believe that everyone is of their own opinion. However, what is lacking here is the skill of EMPATHY. Gay, straight, bi or transgender, people are people. We are all human beings deserving of the same rights as the next. God has made no mistake. Don’t get that twisted. God created such persons and he did so with love. We must be careful how we go about throwing around our words. God has a good sense of humour and for those who think homosexuality is a choice be careful God might just give you a gay child, grandchild etc one day. If that was to be the case, then you would truly wish there were more people supporting gay rights in the Cayman Islands.

    • Anonymous says:

      God created these people with love but according to the bible this is deviant behaviour. I say let people live their lives BUT the essance of a marriage and the origins is a religious ceremony to form a union between a man and a woman. Anything other then that is a perverted exercise. I am not saying they should not be afforded tolerance and common law privliages as they are commited to each other but a marriage is really off limits. This is by no means anything less then sinfully executed ways of life. Whether it is choice or not it does not make it any less sinfull but sins can be forgiven but you do not make them mainstream so that they are accepted as normal. Tolerance is the answer but changing the or perverting the union of marriage is not an accepted answer to appease any person or person.

      • Caymanian LGBT says:

        If the essence and origin of a marriage is a religious ceremony, why are non-Christians, atheists and agnostics permitted to marry? You imply that because of it’s root there is a sanctity that should limit it to those who are religious if you really think about it.

        Equality is what the focus should be. Equality so that an LGBT member can marry their partner and have the exact same legal rights as heterosexual couples do. So what if you call it an apple or a pear, if it’s the exact same thing legally, then there is no distinction.

        • Anonymous says:

          Its hilarious that the Minister of Gender Affairs should spout such ****. Looking to get reelected me thinks.

          • Cass says:

            Marriage being a Roman practice I would say it is not necessarily directly drawn from the bible. The romans were “Christians” too, who by the way crucified not only Jesus Christ but many others. So, in reality if people want to marry the same sex who are we (mere humans like them) to dictate their choices?? Stop allowing fear to dictate your opinions and beliefs. Fear is what is stopping progress today coupled with sheer ignorance. More love, less hate. More humility, less arrogance.

            • Anonymous says:

              You are all confused. The Romans did not become Christians until the 4th century and marriage certainly did not originate with them.

              What you call fear is really having moral standards. Do you think we should have none at all?

            • Anonymous says:

              Then of you mention the Romans………have you heard of Caligula?

    • Anonymous says:

      Good point. Ironically, almost all gay people are from straight parents.

  13. Anonymous says:

    She said she did not “condone violence of any kind, or discrimination in the workplace or otherwise”. Unless it was discrimination she does condone, such as refusing to allow a married gay couple the same immigration rights as a straight married couple.

  14. Anonymous says:

    She is entitled to her view, as an American.

  15. Anonymous says:

    Statistics show that 90% of Nazi babies are self canibalistic, and 10% are also gay.

  16. Anonymous says:

    Being against someone’s marriage because it’s against your religion is like being against someone’s choice to eat a donut because you’re on a diet! We are all humans.

  17. Anonymous says:

    As a Christian, I have learnt to be kind to people who are different. It was only a few decades ago when we would throw around the word “retard”. As I became more educated, I understood that I was hurting people who could not change the way that God made them. Like most people, I am now are very caring and protective of people who have mental handicaps.

    It is the same thing with gay people, their attraction to the same sex is as strong as my attraction to the opposite sex. Neither of us can change the way that we feel. They are not asking me to be gay, so why should I demand that they not be gay and discriminate against them if they don’t change.

    All that they are saying is that they want to be as happy as they can with the life that God gave them and want to live freely with a partner of their choice. Where in Christianity do we profess to deny happiness to another person? Exactly, how is their happiness taking anything away from me as a Christian?

    Even when they get the right to not be discriminated against by law (and they will), they will still live with the social stigma for the rest of their lives. No person in their right mind would choose that. A real Christian will be kind and caring of people that are different and not want to hurt their feelings.

    Tara, you don’t speak for me.

    • Anonymous says:

      There are new testamenters and old testamenters.

      Old testamenters are not Christians.

      Leviticus is not Christian.

      Leviticus is about hate.

      Christ is about love and acceptance.

      Christ is Christian.

      Get used to it and live accordingly.

      • Anonymous says:

        Leviticus is not about hate. Love and acceptance does not mean condoning sin. Jesus never condoned sin or pretended that it was good. Although he stopped the woman caught in adultery from being stoned he told her to go her way and sin no more.

        • Diogenes says:

          Leviticus 20:13 “If a man has sexual relations with a man as one does with a woman, both of them have done what is detestable. They are to be put to death; their blood will be on their own heads”

          Yep, nothing about hate there, no siree. Just not condoning sin – the put to death bit is entirely incidental, and anyway its all their fault.

          • Anonymous says:

            No, it isn’t. I also think what child molesters do is detestable and think they ought to be punished severely. That doesn’t mean I hate them as individuals. I hate what they do.

  18. Mt Mole Hill says:

    Just a thought…. If you are against same sex marriage, then don’t marry someone of the same sex. Can’t we just live and let live? I respect the views of all sections of the community I live in. I just don’t think we are staring down the barrel of same sex couples rutting like beasts on Cardinal Avenue if we acknowledge the world we are living in (and isn’t that reserved for young heterosexual couples during Batabano, anyway?) I have read both The Onion and Leviticus, I respect the views contained therein, but wouldn’t want to live in a society where either was the Operations Manual for living my life.

    • Anonymous says:

      Here is the thing. Cayman has enjoyed a Christianity based society. Agreed that there is tremendous amounts of other forms of sin going on daily from the same people (not all) who are against the union of the same sex. However if these Islands desire to continue a Christian based lifestyle then instead of arguing in favor of the Gay marriage issue as people are sinning everyday here anyway, how about stop doing the other sins? No-one is perfect but the amount of father less children and married people have relations with people other then their spouses is unbelievable. But do not hide behind the above to get the Gay marriages in the backdoor. 2nd, with this statement from Tara and some of her other grand performances she appears to lack the ability to lead and think before speaking or doing, certain things such as the schools, Labour issues etc. Critical thinking skills are needed. Her degrees are impressive but as she is demonstrating they are not giving her the ability to lead with impartiality and what is best for the country and most of all what her constituents are demanding. For me she comes of ignorant on many issues and has gone off half cocked on things that are clearly not in our best interests

  19. Anonymous says:

    It says a “120 Comments”, but i only see one comment.

    CNS: Right under the title “Comments” you’ll find a link to “Older comments”.

  20. Anonymous says:

    I see the gay rights Nazis are out in force. You can have any opinion so long as it agrees with theirs and if it does not then they will bully and victimise you and call you nasty names all the while touting their ‘tolerance’.

    • Anonymous says:

      How ironic…. “The gay rights Nazis”. Yeah cos the Nazis were all about gay rights and inclusiveness.

      This kind of logic could be used to defend ANY prejudice.

    • Diogenes says:

      As opposed to the totally balanced views of the homophobes, because saying that gays want to have sex with children, animals and kill babies is not calling names,

      • Anonymous says:

        Who said that? You’ve got a lot of things confused there.

        • Diogenes says:

          MLA Eden, who does have a lot of things confused,

          • Anonymous says:

            No, you are misquoting Mr. Eden. But that is understandable given the way his speech was reported on CNS together with the content of the letter from the HRC Chairman. For example, he did not say that gays want to have sex with animals or want to kill babies. You have got it all jumbled up. He was remarking on the direction that the application of human rights has taken and the importance of applying a moral standard. Abortion on demand is now a right in many countries. He graphically described one of the methods of abortion to hammer home his point.

      • Anonymous says:

        I think the member indicated that the babies were killed and then eaten.

      • Anonymous says:

        Oh Diogenes, you liberal crusader. Please take a pill and calm down.

      • Anonymous says:

        As a father of a teenage daughter I would not want some strapping stallion type 23 year old male coaching her in say a sport. If she were a he I would be hesitant to have a male gay man coaching my son. This is not discrimination but the way of the world. The Hon. Eden while insensitive on some points spoke on What has guided this country for decades…….Christianity. It is ridiculous to proclaim that all are racist against gay people when one simply disagrees and is receiving guidance from their religion. I feel the homosexuals deserve a voice and need careful deliberating amongst those vested with this importantly historically made descion but should not pisg it home under the fear of the screams of discrimination. Both views are entitled equal weight. In reality the Gay people do not follow the bible and not should anyone be forced to but in this country many doe and it is Cayman culture to base law on. There are places that such talk is followed by a prison sentence. There is no guarantee that a union that is reserved for man and woman is suppose to change. Digest that

        • Anonymous says:

          “strapping stallion type 23 year old male”? Somebody’s been reading gay personal classifieds.

          • Anonymous says:

            Would you want some strapping stallion type coaching your teenage child if it is a girl and if he is a homosexual ( the strapping dude) your son. It is not discrimination as it is a concern both ways.

            • Anonymous says:

              If, by “strapping”, you mean physically fit, why would that be a concern? I would think it would be a positive role model.

              • Anonymous says:

                Oh! I read it as strap on.

              • Anonymous says:

                Well everyone parent would want a weak, spineless, sickly physical education teacher teaching their child…

              • Anonymous says:

                Of course But not if he is openly a homosexual and dresses in short shorts and Is attracted to males. I would have concern. The next thing is that children in their teenage years adopt personalitys of influening people. As a heterosexual male I would not want a homosexual influencing my son and perverting our Christian beliefs. The next thing is while on the topic of gays is that in pursuing a mate their is the dating phase and it is a known fact backed by hard big numbers that the spread of infection amongst gay men like HIV and the famous of the alaphabate viruises hep c is spreading rapidly amongst them just as it is withth injectable drug users. Why would you invite this to your community. Why would you want this to tax your society in the name of human rights. Europe may see how being liberial will serve their people to a determinate. I am sorry but homosexuality is a moral perverting way off life and I feel sorry for them to live in such a hell like state. Man does not lay with man. Full stop. Our streets are criminally controlled due to tolerance liberial and incompetent desions made. Do not throw out the sacried vow of marriage to cave to a few. If the gays cannot marry then maybe Cayman is not the place for them.

                • Anonymous says:

                  So, just to keep the plot here, this guy in the short shorts is gay, and not the same strapping 23 yr.old stallion who’s your daughter’s gym teacher? But they’re both promiscuous and/or pedophiles and can’t be trusted with your daughter or son?
                  Can’t wait to hear about the other scary characters in your life. What about your wife’s very athletic lady tennis coach? And what’s with your yoga instructor?

          • Anonymous says:

            Sounds like you would know!

    • Anonymous says:

      Oh yeah, the problem with the Nazis was the name-calling. Sheesh.

  21. Anonymous says:

    Who cares about the opinion of this one-term wonder?

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